[riggins]

the diary is not particularly well-written

depends on your standards. He's not a professional author but I think he's probably better than your average college grad.

studded with evidence of psychopathy

genuinely interested. could you point to some of these. I've been skimming it and haven't really seen that.

in fact, this struck me as empathetic

James’s mother, Kim Ellis, had just passed away from breast cancer. I cried for a bit. Kim was a very kind-hearted person, and the mother of my best friend. She had been suffering from breast cancer for several years, but I never thought she would die from it. I immediately thought of how James must be feeling. He just lost his own mother!Annotate It made me think of how horrible I would feel if the same thing happened to my own mother, just the thought alone filled me with pain.

[tptacek]

Even if we stipulate that every paragraph in the diary should be taken at face value, psychopathy is not defined simply as the absence of empathy.

[fleitz]

It's actually not really defined at all in terms of an actual medical illness. It's mostly an invention of the criminal justice system.

Sociopathy/Psycopathy is about as real as Drapetomania or hysteria. It's the modern day blasphemy, if you question the state or authority you are 'anti-social'

[gamblor956]

Psycopathy is a defined condition in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, which is published by the American Psychiatric Association. The criminal justice system had nothing to do with the creation of the term.

But you're right--it's not an "actual medical illness." Mental conditions are "disorders", not "medical illnesses" since they are chronic/permanent conditions.

[fleitz]

Really? Can you point me to where in the DSM it defines 'psychopathy', if you find an edition that old you may want to look up another disorder that stems from criminology commonly referred to as 'homosexuality', ironically homosexuality used to be part of 'sociopathy' which was closely related to 'psychopathy'.

[gamblor956]

You need the DSM V, the newest edition. In prior editions, psychopathy was not distinguished from sociopathy. I imagine that you could find it by looking through the index, however I do not have a copy of the DSM V.

I'm not sure why you bring up the characterization of homosexuality in older, long-since discarded versions of the DSM. The DSM is merely a reflection of the current state of consensus regarding psychological diagnoses. It's not an authoritative guide. As consensus changes, so does the DSM.

[adventured]

We understand enough about psychopathy that we can now fairly easily identify it by tests and brain scans. We can also fairly easily identify it in children at a very early age. The symptoms and behaviors are not particularly difficult to pick out. It's obviously very real. Unless you're suggesting child psychopaths have learned how to alter their own brains such that their brain scans look different than normal children and they are capable at the age of six of faking psychopathic behavior every day of their lives.

I suggest you upgrade your knowledge on the topic.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/13/magazine/can-you-call-a-9-...

[fleitz]

We have no objective tests for psychopathy, it's such a sketchy unsupported diagnosis that even the DSM which isn't exactly a pinnacle of science, won't touch it.

We have at best a debatable set of symptoms which are entirely subjective and which are provided by criminologists let alone psychologists.

It's easy to test for and show someone has a cold in a completely objective way, either your cells are infected with a virus with a given genetic pattern or they are not. There is no disease called psychopathy and there is no objective test for it.

So since you're the expert on psychopathy and we know so much about it, what is the underlying physical process for it? Is it an infection? Are the neurons misfiring? Is a certain protein misfolded? Oh wait, you can't answer any of those because it's made up pseudo-scientific bullshit. Labeling someone a psychopath is about as real as labeling them a witch, only symptoms, no cause, no mechanism, nothing.

PS. Here's the 'brain scan' evidence that homosexuality is a real 'mental disorder' LOL http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/7456588.stm

[tptacek]

Uh huh.

[ewoodrich]

At various points, the author describes in detail how he wanted to torture and murder any loving couple because it offended him so much. Along with his bizarre descriptions of a sexless utopia where all women are enslaved and forced to be artificially inseminated to procreate.

[gohrt]

FWIW,

> bizarre descriptions of a sexless utopia where all women are enslaved and forced to be artificially inseminated to procreate.

...is required reading for millions of schoolchildren

http://www.sparknotes.com/lit/1984/study.html

[jljljl]

Yes, but not in the form of an endorsement.

[thrillgore]

Well policymakers do seem to like treating 1984 as an instruction manual as opposed to a satire.

[tod222]

> in fact, this struck me as empathetic

This really isn't empathy. Roger is not feeling his friend's pain—he's transferring his friend's situation to himself and feeling his own pain. He's crying in imagined self-pity.

Roger describes crying in self-pity or frustration many times in the document, even into adulthood. A quick word count:

     34 cried
     10 cry
     19 crying
      9 tears

I read (mostly) the first two thirds of the document and this is the closest Roger gets to empathy.

Otherwise Roger's depiction of himself comes off as completely self-absorbed and often unaware or unconcerned with the feelings of others. The narcissism is overwhelming.

[meric]

The narcissism is a defense mechanism for a badly wounded self, it's not especially unsurprising to see an individual who uses 63 variations of the word 'cry' in a document to exhibit narcissistic behavior.