[morgante]

> The notion that the minimum wage is supposed to provide a living is a good way to remove young people from the job pool.

Exactly. Imposing a price floor on labor does nothing besides driving up unemployment.

I wish people would stop pushing for an increase in minimum wage. Fundamentally people are trying to subsist on low-skill jobs where the supply/demand realities aren't in their favor. That's the problem we need to address, either through a universal basic income (decreasing the supply of labor) or increased training.

A minimum wage just distorts markets and leaves nobody better off.

[hipsters_unite]

> Imposing a price floor on labor does nothing besides driving up unemployment.

Do you have any evidence to back that up? I know it was orthodoxy like twenty to twenty-five years ago, but I remember there were plenty of other theories in my university days.

Pushing young people out of the job pool isn't such a bad thing if there's an educational alternative. Besides, people on lower incomes spend a larger proportion of their income, rather than saving.

Directly increase their disposable income with a minimum wage and I find it hard to believe there won't be an increase in spending in the economy - and that has its own multiplier effects.

Besides, even if what you say is true, then you could pragmatically combine policies for effect; an increase in minimum wage with say, government spending on education initiatives, or raising the mandated school leaving age.

[morgante]

> Do you have any evidence to back that up? I know it was orthodoxy like twenty to twenty-five years ago, but I remember there were plenty of other theories in my university days.

There have been dozens of studies which show a positive correlation between minimum wage and unemployment. Here's just one: http://businessinnovation.berkeley.edu/williamsonseminar/rub...

> Pushing young people out of the job pool isn't such a bad thing if there's an educational alternative.

That might indeed be true, but the problem with a price floor is that you have no control over which workers are displaced. I actually think in many places employers would prefer to keep the teens who can, ex. carry more boxes per hour, than older and potentially more vulnerable workers.

Hence, the right solution is to attempt to shift the supply of minimum wages by ex. providing more support/incentives for college education.

> Directly increase their disposable income with a minimum wage and I find it hard to believe there won't be an increase in spending in the economy - and that has its own multiplier effects.

I'm actually not convinced of that. People living on minimum wage often have negative net worth and depend on credit for day-to-day expenses. Hence all that marginally increasing their wage will do is decrease their indebtedness, not increase their spending. Of course, a huge jump in the minimum wage would be enough to push every employed person into the middle class. But it would provide substantial incentives for automation and essentially eliminate low-skill jobs, creating mass unemployment.

[protomyth]

"Pushing young people out of the job pool isn't such a bad thing if there's an educational alternative."

Do you have any evidence to back that up? You seem to have a very narrow view of "education".

"Besides, people on lower incomes spend a larger proportion of their income, rather than saving."

I think you might want to look at actual statistics on savings in the USA today.

[brightsize]

>Exactly. Imposing a price floor on labor does nothing besides driving up unemployment.

Uh, no. My state, Washington, has the highest minimum wage in the country and is doing better [1] than most states in the US in terms of job creation. I expect Seattle's recent move to a $15/hr minimum wage to improve the economy and the lives of low-wage workers there.

[1] http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-03-05/washington-shows-hi...

[morgante]

That logic is flawed because you're comparing apples to oranges without controlling for exogenous factors.

Perhaps the Washington economy has been growing which allows employers to both pay the higher minimum wage and continue hiring.

If you want to do these terrible comparisons, I'll give you Norway where there isn't any minimum wage yet the unemployment rate is far lower than in Washington (3% vs 6%).

[protomyth]

to add to your point, if we are not considering other factors, North Dakota at $7.25 has the lowest unemployment rate in the US.

[rodgerd]

This is a religious position not actually supported by evidence. Quite the contrary, in fact.

[eiliant]

Do you have evidence for the contrary?