[legohead]

My first impressions of San Francisco were quite opposite of yours -- it was ugly, dirty, smelly and scary. I went for a conference and was in a nice hotel downtown. I went out to grab some dinner at night and couldn't wait to get back, lots of weirdos out on the street. I've been to cities all over the world and never felt as uncomfortable as I did in SF. Maybe I just got unlucky that night...

[nlh]

What the others said. I had similar experiences for basically the first 10 years of my visits to SF - I never really got beyond the Moscone Center / The W Hotel / 3rd Street and that 10-square-block area was my impression of SF.

But having lived here now for almost 2 years, that impression is just so wrong. It's a TINY fraction of SF, and that is not what SF is about. Next time you're here, find a boutique hotel in the Marina, or Pacific Heights, or Russian Hill, or the Mission and Uber over to your conference/meetings (the city's small enough that it's $10-$15 each way).

That's the SF that people love (or hate ;)

[throwaway13qf85]

So your advice is - to enjoy SF, stay in the expensive areas, and get a taxi if you need to go through the poor areas, or the parts where there might be homeless people?

[ritchiea]

Do people ever go to poor areas to enjoy themselves? Wouldn't that be some form of poverty tourism? I don't see any reason to lash out at the comment you're replying to. Saying "these are fun areas in SF (or any city)" is not a political comment. For all you know the commenter you replied to volunteers in shelters, and donates to charities that aid the homeless.

[throwaway13qf85]

> Do people ever go to poor areas to enjoy themselves?

Absolutely! There are many poor areas in London (Whitechapel, Brixton or Dalston, for example) but the idea that you would have to avoid them is crazy. In fact there are great reasons to visit them - the best Indian or Pakistani food in the city is in Whitechapel, the music scene in Brixton is amazing, there are great clubs in Dalston if you don't mind the hipsters.

How has SF let things get so bad that there is a major area of the city that people are told to actively avoid because of all the homeless people?

[malyk]

Some of the best clubs in the city are in the Tenderloin. Some of the best music venues are in areas that are "questionable". Same with the various theaters, the symphony, the opera, etc. They are always packed with people. People who live here don't have an issue going to those places.

[doktrin]

I think you're reading the parent's comment in a particularly negative light. My take-away was along the lines of "take a cab, because it's too far to walk".

I might disagree slightly in that it's easy to hop on metro or BART from the Mission, but if you're in the marina I think taking Uber downtown is totally defensible. Hell, if you're new to the city and don't feel like mucking around with public transit taking a cab is a pretty routine thing to do.

[ethomson]

You did not get unlucky. The Tenderloin is (rightly) considered the worst part of San Francisco, but this spills out quickly into Union Square and Downtown. I've witnessed homeless guys beating each other with brooms in front of a nice restaurant downtown. I've witnessed the sous chef from a Union Square restaurant getting into a fistfight with a guy on the street who was trying to lift some produce that was getting loaded into his kitchen. You have to be careful not to step on needles in Yerba Buena gardens.

The only reedeming quality about the Tenderloin is that you expect it to be sketchy and disgusting. When one pays out the nose to be at a giant tech conference at Moscone, or spends hundreds of dollars a night on a hotel room in Union Square, one is very surprised how disgusting that part of the city is.

[socrates1998]

This was exactly how I felt. I just didn't get the charm.

I have lived and traveled to dozens of major cities around the world. I am an above average sized former linebacker and I felt genuinely unsafe almost every time I went out at night in SF and was walking around. It almost as bad as Tijuana.

SF has tons of potential as a city, but the homeless just ruin it. If SF is so great to it's homeless, then why are they everywhere and making everyone uncomfortable?

I don't know if the problem is wealth inequality or a culture in SF that sees homelessness as a viable lifestyle, but it's just sad.

I am not saying get rid of them by kicking them out. I am saying give them a place to live and sleep so they aren't living on the streets, it's just inhumane.

[doktrin]

San Francisco is slightly unusual among major American cities in that what could very well be areas of prime real estate downtown along Market street are in fact kind of seedy or even dangerous. It's kind of like what I imagine some parts of Manhattan or downtown DC were like in the late 80's, complete with the run down front-and-center strip clubs and weirdly anachronistic porn theaters.

I don't have a particularly good explanation for this. However, most of what defines SF as a city isn't really along Market St, or even downtown for that matter. It's a city of neighborhoods, and without venturing out from downtown you haven't really experienced what the city has to offer. I moved away last year, and still think of SF as one of the world's most interesting cities.

[orky56]

Union Square is one of the most touristy parts yet with a couple wrong turns you're in some very sketchy areas.

[arethuza]

I remember once being a hotel ~15 years ago that was 5 or 6 blocks along (I think) Geary from Union Square - when I told the taxi driver where I wanted to go he said "Do you really want to go there?".

The direction I got from the chap on reception were interesting - basically walk up the hill two blocks and along and back down to Union Square - he was very clear on not walking directly to Union Square. Of course, I did try walking directly back myself late one night - took taxis after that!

[orky56]

I find it even worse. I often stay at Parc 55 and there's a liquor store about 3 doors down that is a nightmare just to walk by. It's a sad sight to see watching homeless people spending the little money they have on booze in the heart of the new Silicon Valley. It's that feeling where you don't know the solution but the problem is so pervasive that you truly feel powerless. You know right from wrong but feel powerless in the easy amoral apathy.

[dntrkv]

Yeah, you were probably in the Tenderloin. The worst part of the city.