[toyg]

>just because people are more laid back and sane here than in the states.

Are they? I distinctly remember the post-riot reactions in London last summer: people got sentenced to years of imprisonment for posting banter on Facebook and Twitter, with full support from mainstream public opinion. Because we're all cool until you touch private property, and then it's HANG THE THIEF! And if you think that's just Brits being Brits, I can show you the electoral results of people like LePen, Wilders, Haider, and the laws this pressure produced...

Do not make the error of confusing historical development with the essence of man: we might look more laid back and "civilised" because of accidents of history that bestowed us a set of marginally saner laws and a bit more perspective (and recent memory), but underneath we're as brutal as anyone else on the planet.

[triplesec]

The riots were in 2011. The punishments were for a different thing. Still, these were really bad punishments. http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2011/aug/16/uk-riots-four-year... . The UK policing approach is more of a middle-class order authoritarianism, "we want to stop this rotten bunch of oiks" rather than "my ego and promotion are founded on jailing anyone I can find", which seems to be the case in much of the US. Nobody was nabbed for just bantering, though, as it seems this kid was, although "just a restraining order" suggests some queries. But knowing what the US cops are (in)capable of, I'm appalled again by the system where they want to put as many people in jail as possible. This was, however, excessive.

A note on rhetoric: I'm glad you mentioned this because I'd forgotten about those convictions. But please Do give links as justification, because you do your arguments a disservice by loose argumentationm and hyperbole.

[toyg]

Apologies, my internal sense of time basically became just a long blur after my first child in 2009 :)

I take your point on sourcing.