[notastartup]

I would start out by saying there's a stigma around mental illness and that it's not a "real" illness and that it's "all in the head therefore not real".

It is exactly this type of attitude we have had since the dark ages that much development of treatment and studies are now only beginning to take more shape.

We have to have a much wider awareness of mental illness and how it affects the basic human rights.

[xenophanes]

How does it affect basic human rights, exactly? Some examples:

People labelled mentally ill can be imprisoned without a trial.

People labelled mentally ill can avoid prison when another person who did the same actions would go to jail.

People labelled mentally ill can be drugged by force.

This is bad for basic human rights, isn't it?

[tunesmith]

There exist some good points that you might agree with, but you're being insufferable.

Yes, it is true that many mental illnesses do not have a "screen" such that if you pass the screen, you have the illness, and if you fail it, you don't.

And yes, it means that the words we use for various mental illness might be catch-all concepts that will eventually fall into disfavor as our biological understanding increases.

And yes, it might also mean that many people who are told they must accept a lifetime diagnosis of "x" have indeed been misdiagnosed, and can later be "cured" (or reject the misdiagnosis, depending on how you look at it).

But. None of those realities mean that people are not emotionally hurting, or that they don't feel trapped to the point of self-destruction. And it doesn't mean they don't need help - emotional or pharmaceutical.

So, while you may have some beliefs or points that are worthwhile in a vacuum, it's extraordinarily insensitive the way you are communicating them, and the implications you are leaving people with. Especially in this thread.

[ceejayoz]

> People labelled mentally ill can be imprisoned without a trial.

So can people not labelled mentally ill, and involuntary confinement happens well within the confines of our legal and justice systems.

> People labelled mentally ill can avoid prison when another person who did the same actions would go to jail.

People found not guilty by reason of insanity are typically kept in a forensic unit with similar levels of freedom as a prison, and typically are detained longer. It's not as if they're turned loose.

> People labelled mentally ill can be drugged by force.

So can people not labelled mentally ill.

[rwallace]

> So can people not labelled mentally ill.

In principle, anything can happen to anyone. In practice, being labeled mentally ill dramatically increases the likelihood of your civil rights being violated in ways that can ruin your life. Changing the law wouldn't solve the problem of mental illness overnight, but it would make it much easier and safer for mentally ill people to seek solutions.

[xenophanes]

So there's other bad things in the world, too. What's your point?

Sometimes people who escape criminal justice via psychiatry get similar levels of freedom. Sometimes significantly less freedom! It can be a way to imprison people for an indeterminate sentence which may last longer than the maximum prison term for their offense. And, sometimes it's quite a lot like they are turned loose. All of these happen.

[ceejayoz]

http://law.jrank.org/pages/1136/Excuse-Insanity-Empirical-da...

"Defendants who asserted an insanity defense at trial, and who were ultimately found guilty of their charges, served significantly longer sentences than defendants tried on similar charges who did not assert the insanity defense. Unsuccessful NGRI pleaders are incarcerated for a 22 percent longer time than individuals who never raise the plea."

Citations included there, by the way. For someone demanding citations, you're mainly throwing out "read Szalz!" and citing nothing.

[rqebmm]

There's probably a strong selection bias here though. If one's trying the insanity defense it's either a.) they're insane and really didn't know what was going on, or b.) they have no other defense and are going for a hail mary. People in both camps are very unlikely to receive shortened sentences or early parole.