[wsxcde]

I'm sorry, I don't follow.

I don't keep my savings in cash, but I can withdraw as much cash as I could reasonably want at zero cost from my bank. How can I do this (i.e., USD->spending money conversion for free) with Bitcoin?

Also, are you making an assumption that the volatility of Bitcoin<->USD will go away at some point in the future? If that happens, keeping Bitcoin around instead of USD will become reasonable.

> But ultimately smarter people than me will figure out the right model. That's the beauty of software platforms.

Sounds like wishy-washy thinking which I hear a lot of from bitcoin advocates.

[bluedino]

>> I don't keep my savings in cash, but I can withdraw as much cash as I could reasonably want at zero cost from my bank.

And once you are over a certain amount, the government finds out.

[wsxcde]

Maybe this is an issue for you, but I don't see this as compelling advantage.

[foley]

I've been working on a Bitcoin card over the past twelve months so I have had a lot of time to think about the benefits and drawbacks of using Bitcoins for everyday transactions and I completely agree with you, no compelling advantage.

Besides the obvious problem of the volatile exchange rate there is just no trust in any of the Bitcoin institutions, if I can't trust anyone else to manage my Bitcoins I need to do it myself. I can do that, but it takes time and effort to maintain secure systems. The real kicker is if something goes wrong, its my problem. If someone hacks my netbanking details the bank will cover my losses.

So what does Bitcoin offer? it opens up transactions that would have otherwise been too risky. Irreversible electronic transactions are Bitcoins niche. However that fact makes it very difficult to acquire Bitcoins with reversible payment methods. This slows down the process of entering and exiting the Bitcoin market leaving you vulnerable to the volatile exchange rate.

I really want Bitcoin to succeed but at this stage there is no way I would use Bitcoin for a transaction unless it was the only option.

[quack]

If someone hacks your netbanking details and sends the money before you realize it the bank most certainly not cover your losses. Debit card fraud transactions have a very short window to report. It's a good thing that you have a 4 digit pin because 4 digits is secure

Bitcoin allows a merchant to recognizing a transaction without considering fraud/KYC. I've sold items on a forum with an escrow moderator and paid 0% in fees. You just cant do that with paypal.

[foley]

The debit card is definitely the weak link, I should get into a habit of minimising its balance. The internet banking is a lot better, they do guarantee it and have two factor authentication.

Good to hear you using Bitcoins for something other than dark markets, we should try to brainstorm other niches where Bitcoin has an edge. I think taxi drivers might warm to it, they definitely hate credit cards.

[XorNot]

Conversely it's illegal to take money which wasn't intended to be sent to you.

Let's say you accidentally type in the wrong BSB (which my father actually did once) and it happens to line up with an account number in that bank (fortunately for him it did not). Even if you send say, $150,000 to that person....it's not legal for that person to accept it. Nor spend it.

See, while they could claim to have spent a portion of it unknowingly the courts would probably view that as fair, they couldn't go "hey I'm rich!" and buy a house that they would be allowed to keep.

I mean, you might not get all the 150k back in the end, but they would definitely not be keeping any of it. And through this process, you'd generally find your bank would be fairly enthusiastic about getting that money back, since as long as it's not on their ledgers they can't lend against it.

[quack]

Sure, but many banks dont care. Thats the whole reason the Nigerian scams work so well.

[CamperBob2]

Also, go to your bank and try to withdraw "as much cash as you reasonably want." At some point they will probably charge you a "Cash Withdrawal Fee," or some such.

I'm interested in Bitcoin because of its stated goal to disrupt the banking system. Banks suck.

Maybe this is an issue for you

Are you a US citizen, or a resident of one of the Five Eyes countries? If so, it's an issue for you whether you like it or not. You commit crimes all the time without knowing it, just like the rest of us do. Your government wouldn't have it any other way.

[dragontamer]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-switch/wp/2013/11/23...

BTC is no different. In fact, all transactions are public in BTC due to the nature of the public crypto system.