[manicbovine]

Yes, and traffic is annoying too. I nonetheless want to have motorized vehicles. I'd similarly like to use my cellphone and want for other adults to make that decision for themselves. If other people irritate me, then I'll go buy some earplugs.

But really, it's a jet plane. Jet engines are really quite loud. Who expects silence on a plane? (nevermind the crying babies, captain announcements, odd two-sided conversations, etc...)

Maybe the best retort to my comment is simply "then don't fly Delta because their customers don't want cellphones on planes."

[ericd]

There's a very large difference between white noise and conversation. I'm pretty surprised that I have to point that out. Then again, you're arguing that we should become less considerate as a society.

[manicbovine]

Or perhaps that the silence mongers should become more considerate.

And white noise tends to drown out human voices. I'm pretty surprised that I have to point that out.

[ericd]

It doesn't drown them out very effectively at the distances you're dealing with in a plane, and cell phones would be worse as people would be talking louder than normal into them. I stepped off a plane an hour ago, and I'm absolutely sure that your proposal would make an already somewhat unpleasant process much worse.

Silence in public places is a coping strategy for crowded environments - it's the least intrusive thing you can do to the other people in your space. It's like the difference between jumping around and shuffling quietly when you're in the middle of a crowd - one may be more fun for the person jumping around, but it's selfish, because it makes everyone else's experience less fun, as their toes get mashed on.

That's really the crux of it. Talking on your cell phone when you're mashed up against other people is a purely selfish act. That's why it will always be considered rude.

[manicbovine]

White noise is a more effective sound barrier in small spaces like planes. This is why the captain's announcements must be broadcast in very high-pitched tones.

Perhaps someone's need for a phone call is more important than my desire for quiet. I don't know, it's completely irrelevant to me because I don't go around looking for things to get offended about.

As a sidenote, I could make your same basic argument about crying babies, and yet nobody would take me seriously if I proposed a ban on babies.

[PKop]

And I'd really like to travel without the annoyance of hearing other passengers loudly talking on the phone next to me. An airline that enforced a no phone call policy would be more desirable to me, all things being equal. Perhaps some will allow it and some won't, and we all can have choices. Also, jet engine being loud not the same as distinctly loud talking. More like a uniform white noise that does not prevent sleeping.

Ultimately I think it just comes down to consideration for others and not being irritating during a long uncomfortable plane ride. I would presume most people would prefer to not listen to others talking and prefer silence. Therefore I think it's just inconsiderate to carry on a loud conversation within a plane where people are forced to have to put up with it and can't avoid the irritation.

[manicbovine]

Yeah, you're right about the choices. (However, I suspect that Delta's position is bad business in the long run.)

This just seems like such a dated and irrelevant stand for Delta to take. Cellphones are here to stay. We live in crowded spaces and it's time for everyone to simply get used to the sound of other humans.

I have no idea why everyone places value on public silence. Is this a holdover cultural strain from the 19th century? Silence is so cheap and so easy to obtain. (And who wants to be the one to make rules which essentially say "shhhh!")

[PKop]

Everybody has their preferences I guess, but I couldn't disagree with you more. I think because cellphones are ubiquitous and used everywhere and always, silence and being able to not have to hear other humans talking on them for a couple hours is a small consolation.

Traveling is uncomfortable. Avoiding one aspect of that discomfort by allowing for some peace and quiet is a minor short term inconvenience for the few people that feel the need to talk on the phone around complete strangers. How about texting.. wouldn't that suffice? Then it would seem both parties could be happy... the callers could get their message across and those that prefer silence wouldn't have to hear it.

[manicbovine]

To tell you the truth, my preference is strongly against cell phones. I don't even have a voice plan.

The thing is that I simply respect other adults enough to let them decide whether it's ok to make a phone call. We're all adults, we all know that loud phone calls are disturbing, and we all might one day have a great reason to make a loud phone call. Sure, there are some rude people, but why let them spoil adulthood for the rest of us?

To put it another way, large institutions should not concern themselves with matters of human etiquette. Rules intended to preserve good manners are almost always more harmful than good. Mundane human relations should be as informal as possible - any time constant formalization of our interactions is an impediment to progress.