[doe88]

This whole battery renting scheme is bad, that's pure greed.

<rambling> I know it's more difficult (orders of magnitude harder) than in sw but we need new startups to emerge in the automobile industry, just like Tesla. I'm french and this is one of the things I worry the most because I think we're not a country where this is possible anymore, this is a shame.

[michaelt]

The remote disabling sounds bad, but from an economic perspective renting batteries could be good for consumers and manufacturers at the same time.

A lot of this battery stuff is very new at the moment. You look at, say, a Panasonic NCR18650 [1] and it's very affordable, but it loses 20% of its capacity after just 300 charge cycles. It depends on temprature, charge rate, depth of discharge and so on, so designers can trade off longevity for upfront cost. There are alternative battery chemistries that last longer - some manufacturers claim more than 10,000 charge cycles [2] but how do you test a manufacturer's claims that a battery will last 30 years without waiting until the technology is 30 years old? Or maybe the future is batteries getting swapped at change stations, Tesla style, so you'll end up with a different battery every day.

We consumers aren't equipped to evaluate the longevity claims of the manufacturers, so why should we take on the risk when that 30-year battery might break after 3 years? On the other hand if we pay by the month or by the mile, if it needs replacement after 3 years that's the manufacturer's problem.

In other words, renting gives the manufacturer an incentive not to cut corners, and to make sure their products are long-lasting and low maintenance, because the longer the product lasts the better the profit. Sure beats the printer ink economic model, where the manufacturers have an incentive to make cheap products that don't last long because selling more replacements means more profit.

[1] http://industrial.panasonic.com/www-data/pdf2/ACA4000/ACA400... [2] http://www.altairnano.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/60Ah-Da...

[bausson]

But what if said manufacturer decide your car is not 'supported' anymore?

You may not even be allowed to turn to alternative battery suppliers, because it might be forbidden by contract. Their are some user protection laws in some countries (say, France), but it won't be the case everywhere.

[michaelt]

I was assuming the rental contracts would be long-term enough to guarantee pricing and availability for the life of the car, e.g. a 10 year fixed price contract with the option to renew at the same price for another 10 years.

It's a nascent industry at the moment - I'm not sure how it will play out. Presumably some day battery lives will be proven, manufacturer reputations will be established, and consumers and regulators will know what to look for, check and standardise. Once the technology risks and information asymmetries are reduced, passing the risks to manufacturers will be less appealing and we might all end up paying up front for our 30-year batteries.

[chris_wot]

In Australia, that's called "third line forcing" and is forbidden by law. Surely the U.S. has the same sort of laws?

[girvo]

From my experience, we get looked after well as consumers in Aus, and the US doesn't have near the protection we enjoy. Not sure if that's the case here, but I know it's true on the whole.

[nl]

This whole battery renting scheme is bad, that's pure greed.

The battery renting thing is great! The relatively short life of batteries and the price of replacing them is one of the biggest problems with electric cars. Renting means that isn't your problems anymore.

[mythealias]

Renting means that isn't your problems anymore.

I wonder when did the companies became so generous to pick the tab for all their customers. Maybe if you are in the market for short duration it might work but I don't see it begin cheaper for the customer in long run.

[bigchewy]

Some people buy cars, some people lease them. Why should batteries be different?

[gpvos]

Even if battery leasing is the future, it would be nice if you were allowed to decide yourself where to lease it.