[maz-dev]

Regarding the taxes, deal with it. full disclosure: I'm french and I like the healthcare system.

You can fire someone easily. You just have to provide a good reason for it. "Oh well, after all I shouldn't have hired him" or "This guys is not the best I could find, he doensn't give 120%" won't allow you to fire someone, no luck you're in France, labor code is sacred here.

VAT is not painful at all, even an accountant fresh out from school could handle this easily. Protip, hire an accountant. If you're a business, VAT is transparent for you. It only impacts french customers.

You don't have to declare every website to the government, you declare it to the CNIL which is an independent administrative body whose goal is to protect data privacy. I like them too.

Why setting up a business in France if you only see the drawbacks of being here?

Though I agree with you on the bullshit part. This incubator is a total waste of money.

[vasilipupkin]

"This guys is not the best I could find, he doensn't give 120%" is a perfectly good reason to fire someone. What other reason could there be? that he or she stole the coffee machine ?

[hbbio]

What maz-dev does not tell is that even if an employee steals the coffee machine, you will have a very hard time firing him. I will cost you a lot upfront and the employee will most probably win in court so you will have to pay him even more.

This is by far France's biggest problem. I had the "privilege" to tell that to our president Hollande, and he just confirmed he does not even understand what's wrong with that.

[maz-dev]

If someone steals a coffee machine, first get a proof. Then you need to set up two meetings before firing the employee. Once this step is done, you send him or her a letter and he/she's officialy fired.

The employee can then request a reexamination in front of a court (prud'hommes). If you have any proof it will cost you 0€, you don't need a lawyer when going on prud'hommes and this will take you max 1 hour of your time. You can then ask some money to the employee to cover the damage caused and the time lost.

If you don't have any proof, then yep, you're fucked, and for a reason "presumption of innocence".

Cool for you to meet M. Hollande, but I'm afraid his role is not to vote laws or change the labor code, other instances less centralized are already dealing with this.

[hartator]

That will be great.

I don't think it's easy to demonstrate a steal. Even if you saw the guy, it will be your word against his, and court rule 8 of 10 against employer.

[maz-dev]

That could be a reason. You could also agree on clear goals with the employee and fire him if goals are not met. No problem. Just take the time to agree on clear, written, and official goals with him. You can fire him if you're in a difficult situation financialy speaking. But you have to prove this.

Not being an overachiever is by no mean a reason to be fired, not in France.

Things are changing slowly though, new types of contracts are being voted. They should bring "Flexibility". Give France a few years and you will be able to fire someone just because he's wearing a yellow shirt.

Given the mindset of french workers and unions, this new type of contract should actualy lower the overall productivity.

[rschmitty]

Pretty sure you get burned at the stake if you fire someone for not working extra hard in France.

[medlazik]

"This guys is not the best I could find"

Entirely your fault, deal with it. The guy you hired is not responsible.

"He doesn't give 120%" Illegal. You don't force someone to work for free.

A good reason would be that he gives only 50%, not that he stole the damn coffee machine... Wrong mentality here imho.

[hartator]

> Regarding the taxes, deal with it. full disclosure: I'm french and I like the healthcare system.

Sure.. How long will it last?

> VAT is not painful at all, even an accountant fresh out from school could handle this easily. Protip, hire an accountant. If you're a business, VAT is transparent for you. It only impacts french customers.

It's a myth. Companies pay VAT, you pay 19,60% of the value added by your company.

> You don't have to declare every website to the government, you declare it to the CNIL which is an independent administrative body whose goal is to protect data privacy. I like them too.

They haven't stop PRISM. Nothing is independent, the CNIL gets its money from state taxes, it's government.

> Why setting up a business in France if you only see the drawbacks of being here?

I am from france.

> Though I agree with you on the bullshit part. This incubator is a total waste of money

We agree on something! :)

[conradfr]

Sorry, you don't understand how VAT works.