[LekkoscPiwa]

because we all know that then all kids would be hungry and not educated not only the poor ones. Somehow socialism always ends up making everyone equally poor and not equally rich.

I read recently that in Canada waiting time for some surgeries are 6 months. For everyone. People who can afford and people who can't afford. Everybody screwed over. But of course that's what socialism is all about - making all people equal. In their poverty.

[throwaway9848]

What a bunch of nonsense. If you look at aggregate numbers, people in socialist countries on the average are healthier and live longer. And the children of Canada, France, Britain, Norway, and so on do not go hungry. Amazing!

I don't even agree with a lot of western European style socialism, but it sucks that because of people like you we can't even have an honest, adult conversation about it. Thanks loads.

[alexqgb]

Well said good sir! Your grasp of basic facts about the world is truly impeccable. Why, I myself just got back from Sweden where I had a layover on the flight from Mozambique. Or did I stop in Mozambique on my way back from Sweden? Now that I think about it, I can't be sure! I mean, honestly, who can tell them apart? Not me! Or you!

[taylodl]

Did you check out the author of what you read and what agenda they may have had? Plus the term "some surgeries" is pretty vague, indicative of hand-waving.

But consider the alternative - without insurance or money your waiting time for surgery is...forever.

All health service is rationed. Our system simply doesn't ration it to those needing it most, instead rationing it to those with the most money. You can see the effects of our system with all the new "designer hospitals" they're building these days. By focusing on the affluent we're pricing health care out of reach of those of modest means. There are reasons health care costs in the United States have been rising several times more than the rate of inflation for the past 30 years. And none of those reasons paint a good portrait of our health care system.

[disbelief]

You might want to base your opinion on more than one thing you read somewhere. I have a friend who was diagnosed with cancer in Canada and was in surgery with one of the top surgeons in the country in under a week. That plus a lengthly stay in the hospital and all of the drugs associated with cancer were 100% covered by our healthcare system. How is this poverty?

[victorf]

Because your taxes are so high that people who might otherwise be able to afford a private jet now cannot? Not having a jet is quite embarrassing and really harms the jet-less that have to fly in merely first class.

[victorf]

Of course the proper way to order surgeries is to give priority to the wealthy persons so they can quickly get on with creating jobs. Lazy poors aren't going to do anything significant anyway, so they can wait eight or nine months and it doesn't matter.

I cannot imagine raising taxes any further, if a wealthy child's parents couldn't afford to send him to a private school imagine what a terrible education he will have! He might even end up poor himself, which, I'm sure we can all agree, is a fate we should reserve for the already poor.

[dkuntz2]

You know, your first paragraph sounds strikingly similar to the premise of an episode of Star Trek: Voyager, Critical Care (http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Critical_Care_%28episode%29)...

They also found the idea silly.

[victorf]

(The Voyager doctor was a pretty good character)

It is absurd. Everyone complaining about the wait is asserting implicitly that they need to be allowed to get their healthcare before anyone they are able to outbid.

Personally, yes, I want everyone poorer then myself to wait until my surgery is done. But that's because I'm not so far down. Is it what's best for society? Most likely not.

Probably ideally for healthcare you would live in Canada where it is not the worst cost to health ratio of all the western countries, but you're also able to nip down to the US and cut in line in a pinch.

[mason55]

There's a huge difference between socialism and a minimum living standard