[f1nch3r]

Growing up as a conservative, hyper-patriotic American it pains me to say that I hate my country. A young man exposes wrongdoing by the military and gets sentenced to 35 years in prison while the administration that started an illegal war with Iraq, costing untold American and Iraqi lives, are free.

[tomjen3]

Don't hate your country. First he leaked a ton of classified military stuff, not just bad or morally questionable things and while his treatment was shameful, the judge did take that into account during sentencing.

Finally don't hate your country because it is actually great. In most nations we would never have heard of this because it would be the way things were done, second it was the US that thought the rest of the world the ideas behind freedom. Sure it fails from time to time, but that is just because it is compromised of humans, who are awesome but fallible creatures.

[Frozenlock]

"second it was the US that thought the rest of the world the ideas behind freedom"

Wow. Just wow.

'Murica, much?

[tomjen3]

Actually Dane, but yeah I like the US. I don't often agree with their government in the things that end up in the media, but I like the country and I have a serious and profound respect for the genius of Jefferson.

[qznc]

"it was the US that thought the rest of the world the ideas behind freedom"

The US thought the rest of the world how an arrogant world police looks like. The ideas of freedom (aka democracy I assume) mostly originate from europe (greek republic, french revolution, reformation, enlightenment). The american revolution is certainly important, but not the only one. Also, remember that you got some serious help from France in that revolution.

[tomjen3]

(not from the US, in case that wasn't at all clear).

I have some respect for the ideas of the French revolution, but it ended in a serious dictatorship, a reign of terror and a lot of death people instead of freedom.

[f1nch3r]

If you want to wave the flag that is your prerogative. Today, I hate my country. You can't change my opinion.

[PhasmaFelis]

Better than the worst is not good enough.

[dwrowe]

You can love your country and despise the actions of its government. "America" is more than the government.

[alan_cx]

This is why I try so hard to separate the US government and the American people.

However.... I cant pretend that the US people didn't vote for Obama, and Bush and Clinton before him. In a democracy the people have to take responsibility for the governments they themselves vote for. And no, ignorance is still not a defense.

This equally applies to my country, the UK. In the end, my real disgust is with my fellow Brits who also voted for all this, and seem not to care. Again, not just this current regime, but the Blair one before it.

We all vote for the same people, the same system over and over again. So, why on earth should or would government ever change? "We" condone it.

[jpttsn]

At the same time, the present implementation of Democracy doesn't give voters very many options.

I am very divided on this.