[300bps]

In many cases, thinking that we are limited is itself a limiting factor.

I've noticed this is true in ever facet of my life. When I was 14, I memorized pi to 50 digits with almost no effort. Later, I memorized it to 100, then 200. I realized at that point that I could memorize anything that I wanted to. I memorize phone numbers, credit card numbers, everything with almost no effort and not using any mnemonic device. It's so handy when buying something on the Internet to have every credit card in my wallet memorized.

Invariably when I demonstrate this to someone I get the, "Oh I could never do that, my memory is terrible." I actually convinced a friend of mine many years ago that he could in fact memorize pi to 100 digits... and he did and still remembers it to this day. I'm convinced anyone can do this and the major thing stopping them is their belief that they can't do it.

[devindotcom]

I'm happy you have this ability, but suggesting that everyone else just isn't living up to their potential because of some mental block that you have supposedly (and accidentally) overcome is, perhaps, limiting your compassion. You are very lucky to have an exceptional memory; others are not so lucky, and must work hard to do what costs you no effort. Supposing they just aren't trying hard enough or are succumbing to some crippling lack of self-faith is belittling and people will rightfully resent it.

[300bps]

I'm not sure if you read my comment before becoming offended by it.

Your response makes it all about me, but I specifically mentioned other people being surprised by their own memorization capabilities after I asked them to consider that maybe they're more capable of memorizing numbers than they believed.

Your comment also says that I memorize through "no effort" when I stated, "almost no effort" which is > "no effort". When I originally memorized pi to 50 digits it took about 15 minutes which is what I could consider "almost no effort" but that's more than 15 seconds which is what I would consider "no effort".

And I'm sorry my comment made you resentful. Hopefully you don't resent other people telling you how with little effort they were able to increase their vertical jump or learn how to play the guitar.

[cscheid]

I'm quoting you:

> I'm convinced anyone can do this and the major thing stopping them is their belief that they can't do it.

It's not a matter of taking offense. It's a matter of your assumption. It took you little effort. And it might take many people little effort. But by saying "anyone" and "their belief that they can't do it" in the same sentence you disenfranchise people who, you know, might actually have tried this and failed.

This type of statement tends to irk some people (and I'm here assuming sillysaurus is part of this group) because the same structure is present in all kinds of victim-blaming statements ("oh, you don't work hard enough, that's why you're poor. You have to believe in prosperity").

Let me be clear, I'm not saying that you'd actually use the more horrible versions of the pattern. I'm simply hoping to explain sillysaurus's strong reaction to your original post.

[amirmc]

> "I'm not sure if you read my comment before becoming offended by it."

That post didn't read to me like he was in the slightest bit offended.

It's simply making the point that if you view the world through a lens of "you can do anything if you just try" then there's a downside of becoming less compassionate as one might ascribe to laziness what may (more correctly) be ascribed to a genuine physical or mental inability.

[300bps]

That post didn't read to me like he was in the slightest bit offended.

He said that my post was belittling and he was resentful of it.

That seems to be a textbook definition of offended. Please tell me how I misunderstood.

[devindotcom]

I am not offended. I wrote that the sentiment I described was belittling and people would resent it.

[300bps]

I am not offended. I wrote that the sentiment I described was belittling and people would resent it.

Sorry, I don't believe you. You were either directly speaking for yourself or you were using weasel words a la, "people would resent it."

In either case, you should man up to the fact that you were truly speaking for yourself. There were three people that voiced their offense at what I said. Two appeared to not be able to avoid petty insults and name-calling. One of those two ended up deleting the dozen or so responses they had in here, apparently ashamed of what they wrote.

I'm still hoping that you'll own your words more than the other two.

[paisawalla]

Personally, I would rather have a mediocre memory and mediocre emotional intelligence, than an exceptional memory and the complete lack of EQ which you're demonstrating here.

Hopefully you don't resent other people telling you how with little effort they were able to increase their vertical jump or learn how to play the guitar.

Nope, I wouldn't. But if they then concluded from their own lack of effort that I should also be able to jump higher and play the guitar with similar ease, then they should expect it.

[300bps]

the complete lack of EQ which you're demonstrating here.

I would think someone with even a mediocre EQ would have more tact than telling someone they have a complete lack of EQ.

[clicks]

I underwent a formal psychological evaluation a few years ago, my shrink informed me that I have incredibly bad memory (I was ranking in at 1-2 percentile for two or three different memory tests). But yet, I've also been able to memorize pi to about 50 digits, I've memorized the entire periodic table, and I've memorized whole poems in Latin (despite knowing very little Latin).

The thing I've found to be true in my case is that I do have bad memory in general -- but this is because of the unique childhood I had: I was never forced to memorize anything. I've a habit of referencing my smartphone when I need to know what someone's phonenumber is, I've a habit of looking at address books and maps to know where someone is, instead of making a concerted effort to think where they live beforehand. My brother-in-law is the opposite of me: he purposely avoids using his smartphone/GPS, and instead looks at Google Maps directions before taking off for the trip... and relies on it with memory. I asked him why he did that instead of just using the GPS that he does have and he straight up told me he does these things for memory exercises. So now, at least for the past few months, I've also been making a concerted effort in improving my memory and I've found that I can do these incredible things... I can memorize pi to 100 digit, I can memorize pages of books that are in a language I barely understand -- despite my shrink telling me that I have terrible memory.

So I don't think 300bps's comment was offensive at all. Memory is very much a skill that can be improved with dedicated effort. I'm someone who long believed until recently that I had bad memory and I had to deal with it... but this is not true, I can do mental exercises to improve it. Research has proved time and again that learning new languages, new musical instruments, etc. are great exercises to keep the mind/memory sharp. I implore you to look into the idea: use little tricks, read the book "Moonwalking with Einstein" (it's about memorizing things in fun ways), take about a week to memorize digits of pi (spend about 10 hours, I'd say -- use various techniques (which you can read up on online)), and get back to us. See if you truly can or can't memorize pi to the 50th (or even 100th) digit if you really put the effort to it. The more you do it, the more your ability will improve. If it takes you 5 hours the first time around to remember some 50 digits, it'll take you just one hour the next 50th time you do it.

[CDRdude]

What mental exercises do you find effective at improving memorization, and what would you recommend to a beginner?

[wamatt]

There is likely an element of truth to OP's general point.

For example, journalist and author, Joshua Foer[1], talks about the astonishing feats of memory by average people. It becomes more persuasive, when it turns personal. While he starts out by writing a story on memory championships, he decides to take it further and delves deep into learning the techniques himself. Some time later, he ends up becoming the USA Champion!

"In 2006, Foer won the U.S.A. Memory Championship, and set a new USA record in the "speed cards" event by memorizing a deck of 52 cards in 1 minute and 40 seconds"[1]

The Ted Talk provides more detail [2].

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joshua_Foer

[2] http://www.ted.com/talks/joshua_foer_feats_of_memory_anyone_...

[nfoz]

I suspect your concept of memory is incorrect. Outside of rare people with deep automatic synaesthesia or other sever mental differences, I don't think there's much variation in different peoples' inherent "ability to remember". People aren't generally better or worse at remembering things by some innate property of their brain. It is a skill, and one can practice and improve at it, and there are lots of very powerful memory techniques, especially including specific problems like "memorizing digits".

I strongly recommend the book "Moonwalking with Einstein" which was very enlightening for me.

[snowwrestler]

It does not take exceptional memory to memorize pi to 100 places--for context, that is only 10 phone numbers worth of digits.

The research is on the parent's side: most people can improve their memory performance with focused practice.

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2011/02/20/magazine/mind-...

This should not seem that surprising; we easily accept that most people can improve their physical fitness with exercise, for example.

[gems]

If this response by devindotcom was really "irrelevant nitpicking", then there is an easy solution to that: correct yourself immediately and be very explicit about it. The remainder of this branch could have been avoided completely.

300bps didn't do that though. So did he/she actually mean what was said? Well no, because 10 minutes later your criticisms will be dismissed as [strikethrough]pedantry[/strikethrough] silliness.

[sown]

Others here are skeptical that just anyone can memorize pi to an arbitrary length. One way you can test if this has to do with you being 14 when this happened, is to memorize phi or e to 100, 200 or so digits with no mnemonic device. Or, maybe a string of random words or the contents of an entire magazine, each 100s of items long. It all depends on you being honest, but I'm curious. Maybe your brain has changed since then or you learned how to do this, but at a certain age when the brain was more malleable, hence the window of training was very narrow and adults like myself can't do this, either.

If you can memorize this without a mnemonic device, then I hate to break it to you, you are a mutant with Eidetic memory. And, so incidentally was your friend.

If you can't, then perhaps you've found a special, easy way to make memorizing numbers easy. Perhaps you should start a website and sell this technique?

[nerfhammer]

People who have preternaturally good memories invariably turn out to have intuitively rediscovered classic mnemonic techniques at a young age and have used them semi-consciously without realizing it most of their lives.

[tghw]

I'm not sure it's possible to not use a mnemonic device. Our brains record information by association, which, by definition, is a mnemonic device.

I highly recommend reading Moonwalking with Einstein. It's about a journalist who got interested in memory competitions and, with a lot of practice, ended up winning the US memory championship. Anyone can do it.

[0] http://www.amazon.com/Moonwalking-Einstein-Science-Rememberi...

[epidemian]

You've received a lot of criticism for that comment, but, considering myself as having a very bad memory, i'm grateful that you posted it. It made me reconsider how much of my "terrible" memory is because it actually sucks or because i already have a preconception that i'll forget about everything if i don't write it down.

You see, it's not that my memory is equally terrible for all things. Sometimes i forget about things i was told literally seconds ago; but somehow i remember quotes from The Simpsons episodes that i haven't seen in years, or equally seemingly useless stuff. So, what makes these things different? Maybe the situation of being told something and thinking "shit, i must remember this! [but i probably wont]" actually makes things much worse.

[300bps]

You've received a lot of criticism for that comment, but, considering myself as having a very bad memory, i'm grateful that you posted it

Thanks. Just to dig the hole deeper for myself - I used to have a terrible time falling asleep when I was younger.

For the past 20 years though I sleep like a baby every night. If I wake up in the middle of the night (normally due to one of my 3 children or my wife), I fall back asleep with no problem.

Honestly the only thing I did differently was I managed to convince myself that I am a great sleeper. I found the thing that was keeping me up nights was worrying about how much sleep I was going to eke out that night.

I'm sure someone will now say how arrogant and smug I am because they have a disorder that causes them to smack themselves in the face every 10 seconds which makes good sleep impossible.

i already have a preconception that i'll forget about everything if i don't write it down.

I purposely write nothing down temporarily. I deal with CUSIPs at work a lot and I will purposely memorize them for short time periods instead of copying/pasting them because I find the more I do it, the better I am at it.

[JRobertson]

This topic is one that my wife and I talk about regularly.

She is slowly learning to better control her anxiety, but one side effect is that she worries about sleep, all the time. She almost universally resists committing to morning activities because she's worried about how much sleep she'll get the night before.

We just got back from a vacation where she slept like a rock the whole time despite sharing a room with our two kids, a noisy ventilation system and the sounds of the city. I told her it was because she didn't care how much sleep she got.

I've noticed the same thing in myself. The nights I slept the worst are the nights where I care/worry how much sleep I will get.

[xauronx]

Man, this is so disappointing that everyone shits on you for this post. Just like most negative internet forums, you end up with one person putting themselves out there and telling about their experience and then 100 people criticizing everything about it (and plenty of stuff they made up about it).

Anyhow, I think your root sentiment is valid (that most people are only limited by what they believe they can accomplish). Most people take offense to the "little effort" part, but I believe that if you through pure will power accomplish something you thought you would NEVER accomplish, that's "little effort". Most people would probably be surprised by their progress in something if they just put their heads down and worked at it.

[vehementi]

I see this a lot on HN, people embarrassing themselves by totally missing the point of some post / article / blog / whatever and raging about the tone or taking issue with some particular usage.

Oh no, this guy maybe over reached in his assumption about how well general people can memorize numbers! Better make ourselves look like idiots and go wildly off point about it!

Check out the thread about that guy's blog "Kids these days can't use computers" as a prime example :(

[gioele]

> I actually convinced a friend of mine many years ago that he could in fact memorize pi to 100 digits... and he did and still remembers it to this day. I'm convinced anyone can do this and the major thing stopping them is their belief that they can't do it.

I have similar experiences with (re)teaching basic math tricks and approximation to adults. "Oh, I wish I could to that but I suck at math" is a quite common response. I love the flash in their eyes when, after a short explanation, they make their first multiplication by 9 or division by 5 without the use of a calculator.

What I still don't understand is why some people are satisfied after learning the first trick while other (only 1/10th max) ask for more tricks. Shouldn't the idea of having learnt something new _always_ sparkle the interest in learning more?

[klibertp]

Learning something new is fulfilling, but it tires you at the same time. I think that you'd have much more people wanting to learn again if you asked them after some time.

[GoNB]

Eh, no mnemonic device? Most people memorize things by simple repetition. If you're implying anyone can have eidetic memory by "removing their limits", I don't buy it. It's something developed at a young age.

[300bps]

If you're implying anyone can have eidetic memory by "removing their limits"

What I said is that most people don't try to memorize things because they think that they can't.

Most people memorize things by simple repetition

Sure, and most people don't try to memorize things because (again) they think that they can't no matter what technique they use.

I don't buy it

I'm not selling anything. I'm merely passing on my own experiences and those of my friends. If you choose to continue to believe you can't memorize things because of some innate lack of ability, it doesn't affect me at all.

[GoNB]

> Sure, and most people don't try to memorize things because (again) they think that they can't no matter what technique they use.

Citation? I mean, you're saying "most people" after all. If we're just talking anecdotes here, I've never met anyone who couldn't memorize something with simple repetition technique. When people say they have "poor memory", they are referring to not having eidetic memory. For example: "I don't remember her name! I have terrible memory." Well, it's probably because you only met her once in passing. It's not like you went home, wrote her name on some flash cards and crammed it into your memory. You weren't holding yourself back thinking "I can't remember her name because I have terrible memory!" It's simply that some people have eidetic memory and some don't. You can't learn eidetic memory by "thinking you can" or sheer will. It's developed at early childhood. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eidetic_memory)

> I'm not selling anything. I'm merely passing on my own experiences and those of my friends. If you choose to continue to believe you can't memorize things because of some innate lack of ability, it doesn't affect me at all.

You are overly pedantic. It's just an expression.

[300bps]

Citation? I mean, you're saying "most people" after all.

I think you may be the most confused person in this thread. Go ahead and re-read this particular branch of it.

You said most people first. I then quoted your use of "most people". So I guess the appropriate thing for me to do at this point is to snarkily ask for your citation?

[sown]

> I'm not selling anything. I'm merely passing on my own experiences and those of my friends. If you choose to continue to believe you can't memorize things because of some innate lack of ability, it doesn't affect me at all.

Fortunately, there's a large body of scientific research that can tell us how many numbers a person can memorize in short term memory (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Magical_Number_Seven,_Plus...) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exceptional_memory

[orionblastar]

I am glad that you developed an excellent memory. I used to know PI to 30 digits but forgot it and got some digits wrong.

You might want to write a book on memory and memorizing things using what you learned when you were young. People like me need to learn that. My memory is not perfect, and I am often picked on for not being able to remember stuff.

I believe that I can do it, and am not sure why I fail. Ever since I developed a mental illness in 2001, I've been having memory issues and difficulty concentrating. The psyhe meds for example make me dizzy, confused, and drowsy. In 2003 I could no longer work as I was too sick and became disabled. I always wanted to get out of this rut and get back to work some day. I am 45 now, and nobody wants to hire someone that old these days.