Hacker News new | ask | show | jobs
by knowaveragejoe 4715 days ago
Isn't this still, in essence at least, Steganography?
1 comments

Nope. You would be painting a huge red target on yourself if you tried something like this.

The purpose of steganography is not to get noticed in the first place. It's orthogonal to regular cryptography.

Unfortunately, common steganography algos used on images are easy to detect with statistical analysis.
Images are just the lowest hanging fruit and attract a lot of sloppy schemes. You can encode information in pretty much anything as long as you are free to choose the message.

You could even encode info in plain text by the lengths of non-whitespace characters, modulo 2. As an example, try using the so-defined scheme on the letters count of this very sentence; they're encoding, repeatingly, S.O.S.

Posts of similar length as this one are enough to send a public key using ECDH and negotiate a shared secret for use with a block or stream cypher. You could then send short messages using this shared secret inconspicuously. Shannon entropy of English is about 1.5 bits per character so you could store quite a bit if you cared to compress it well before encrypting, preferably using a shared static dictionary.

Can you elaborate?
People read a book, they see a simple description of steganography, they whip up an implementation as a proof of concept, they share that code, other people think it's secure when it's not meant to be.

(http://www.ifp.illinois.edu/~ywang11/paper/CISS04_204.pdf)

(http://eprint.iacr.org/2005/305)

(http://vision.ece.ucsb.edu/publications/sullivan_ICIP06.pdf)

Steganography suffers from the warden problem: being in possession of steganography software is suspicious regardless of whether or not you use it.
A solution to this is to increase the "noise floor" by bundling steganography tools with common widely distributed software, so that obviously 99+% of people and computers with steganography software would be 'innocent'.

For example, if Ubuntu default installation would create a small (10mb?) sized volume filled with random bits and install an appropriate steganography tool designed to write/read encrypted data there, then it would enable anyone to hide some arbitrary data while having a file/software setup that's not distinguishable from millions of others in any way.

"A solution to this is to increase the "noise floor" by bundling steganography tools with common widely distributed software, so that obviously 99+% of people and computers with steganography software would be 'innocent'."

Good luck with that one. As a practical matter, this is unlikely to happen; hardly anyone requires steganography as part of their security solution (the MPAA stands out due to the use of watermarking). Email and online businesses were the killer app for public key cryptography; what killer app do you see for steganography?

I don't see a killer app for that - the whole point is not that millions need it, but that all tools needed for steganography are shipped also to millions of people who don't need it.

Someone (preferably multiple organizations) should bundle steganography just because it's desperately needed for a tiny minority - doing so would not be because of a killer app but simply a service for public good, facilitating democracy, free speech, whistleblower protection, etc.

This is aligned with the stated ideals of multiple FOSS organizations, so it is feasible to assume that someone with popular widespread software (like, say, Firefox, Ubuntu or VLC) could do that for purely idealistic reasons. The software size is tiny, so the distribution overhead would be trivial while making a serious strategic change. Do it just because it can be done.

The default installs of shells and window managers are likely to reveal whether the command has either ever or recently been run.. Disabling the defaults is also "suspicious".

I don't think you can fix a social problem with a technical fix. Innocent until proven guilty (of a crime with a victim please!) has to apply to employment law and clearances. Otherwise we are building a group of criminals who can honestly be believed when they say they are willing to violate the constitution to protect executive branch interests.

The trouble with the Snowden case is that the NSA now has more power to filter its employees/contracts in order to further violate the terms of the agreement.

Even drastic action would not fix it. Impeach the entire chain up the executive branch and the next one will be more secretive and let Hoover shine as the simple misunderstood Prom Queen he wanted to be.

I just hope Obama's actions will ruin him and this nonsense about replacing the President with an outsider. If that suddenly gets you an honest system instead of a cynical President, then kissing the frog must work too.

Whistleblowing would be a killer app.

Imagine you wanted to leak something but don't want to attract attention to yourself. You could encrypt it (with the public key of the organization you want to leak to), hide it with steganography and then upload the result to some public place you know the organization would be monitoring.

If you had ready access to tools to do so you could do all that inconspicuously.

Is that really true? Steganography is a lot of work to set up surreptitiously (we're not all IT techs like Snowden); it also gives you a rather narrow channel to send messages through, and you still need to attach the channel to the recipient somehow. Then, afterwards, you'll want to make sure you haven't left any stego-litter that will be detected and used against you.

By contrast, a USB flash drive or micro-SD card is tiny, easy to set up surreptitiously, gives you a channel for a whole lot of data, and doesn't usually leave much evidence after you hand it over to the recipient. I'd hazard that people who care enough to strip-search you for unauthorized mass-storage devices at the door could probably also detect your steganography too, if it comes down to it.

I would imagine that there are really very few circumstances related to whistle-blowing when it would make sense to choose steganography. It seems more appropriate for espionage situations where a deep-cover field agent really, really needs to receive messages through a channel that's essentially untrackable (e.g. classified ads in a newspaper).

In that respect, is it any worse than being in possession of a copy of GPG?
The noise level with GPG is fairly high. Anyone with a modern Linux distro install has a copy by default.
No, but it is not any better either. There are other issues to consider as well e.g. the lack of widely deployed public key stegosystems.
That's why you should always steganographically hide your steganography software.