[soemarko]

> The thing is, a lot of apps can't work without push, or work a lot worse without push, and I think users aren't well equipped to decide in a few seconds.

Umm, No. For me, it's an easy choice. If it's productivity app, push please. If it's a game, nope. I couldn't care less if my friend need me to visit her farm in the middle of the day, while I might enjoy the game when I'm in the john.

I even wish the local notification follow the push notification rules.

[davidkatz]

I think you're making generalised, quick calls because you've been burned by spam, which I get. Doesn't mean there aren't a ton of apps out there that would provide value with notifications but are hard to assess.

[jvzr]

Do you have an example of such app? We keep coming up with examples of bad push notifications, yet cannot come up with examples of good ones. Genuinely curious.

[davidkatz]

Sure. As I mentioned elsewhere in this thread, I want to send users a "your order has shipped" notification, when an order they paid for shipped.

[jvzr]

Seems like a legitimate use then. How have you gathered stats to let you think that your users are vastly refusing push notifications for you to request it in iOS 7?

[davidkatz]

I use MixPanel to track permissions conversions, and they're at roughly 60%. So 40% of users assume they're going to get spammed, even though they're not.

[soemarko]

> So 40% of users assume they're going to get spammed

That is your assumption. Not your customers'. They probably just don't need another push notification if they also got the email confirmation that the item has been shipped. Or they just prefer to not be disturbed unless it's really important matters.

Update: just had a look at your app. I understand why people don't want push notifications from it. It's not the type of app that really needs attentions like chat, phone call, meetings, email, or tasks. I'll probably use it once. or a few more times if I'm happy with the tiles first time around.

> If users feel spammed, deleting the app is a few taps away.

Are you seriously prefer people delete your app after using it once rather than have it around in case they forgot you exist? "Which app you get that pictures from again? PhotoCeramic?"