[swombat]

Kind of puts the "sexism in tech" discussion in perspective. These guys make the Mad Men lot sound respectful.

Here's a simple way they could deal with that - create a new company (or even just a new department within the company), hire only civilised people, fire anyone who proves to be an uncivilised jerk, and slowly grow that department/company to take over the company/industry because it's not full of retards...

[mattdeboard]

> hire only civilised people, fire anyone who proves to be an uncivilised jerk ... because it's not full of retards...

Complaining about sexism then using "retards" as a pejorative is just too ironic.

[UnoriginalGuy]

That caught me off guard too. I didn't realise anyone used the term anymore.

Maybe the OP used it to make a point?

[swombat]

I don't call mentally handicapped people retards, I call them mentally handicapped people.

Retards, in my vocabulary, means someone who is not mentally handicapped but is a cretin. I could have used the word "cretin", in fact.

[UnoriginalGuy]

So you'd happily use the N' word, "fag," "gay," and similar since you can re-define them in your head to be just general insults, rather than associating negativity with the groups for which these words were originally used?

Sorry but we both know the reason you're using that word is because you want to paint them as being mentally handicapped which you perceive as "bad." You can pretend that isn't what you're doing but even if that is true that is how others perceive it, because when they hear the word "retard" they think mentally handicapped and you're using it as a derogative.

[swombat]

Retard does not have the same "inappropriate" connotations in the UK as in the US (certainly it's nothing like using nigger or fag(got) in conversation as a pejorative).

But yes, I do think being mentally handicapped is "bad". Are you arguing that it's "good"?

[UnoriginalGuy]

I live here. Yes it does.

[onemorepassword]

These guys are disrespectful, insulting and pathetic, but at least she got the job and none of the anecdotes suggest they assumed she was incapable of doing that job.

That's already two steps up from Mad Men territory.

And beside the crudeness, which is more a social class difference than anything else, I don't see how this differs from the reports of sexism in tech. At least she's got the (albeit clumsy and inadequate) support of her employer. They weren't advertising job posts for "brogrammers".

Being less crude than construction workers is not exactly a high standard for tech.

[sp332]

The guys (well, some of them) are discussing her treatment behind her back. One of them even apologizes every time he swears in a meeting. That means even the ones who care honestly don't know how women want to be treated in a workplace. (Of course, part of the problem is that they are constructing some kind of universal ruleset without considering her as an individual.)

It seems that no one knew which guys were the jerks before because they acted reasonably when women weren't around. I think the same thing happened in tech circles. There are some major assholes and even creepy stalkers that don't really show themselves until women show up, so they go unnoticed for years by the male majority.

[treerock]

I would love it if there was a way of testing these things out. I've a sneaking suspicion (based on absolutely no reason) that the company 'full or retards' would outperform the company of nice, respectful people. But the real world is a big messy place.