[josh-j]

The Java frameworks are generally doing very well (top quarter to top half), and the PHP frameworks are generally doing very poorly (bottom half). PHP-raw is doing well, but that's not heartening given how mature its frameworks should be (if we were talking about golang, I think that argument would be sound).

[camus]

That's the point of PHP , you dont need a framework to do web development with PHP. PHP is merely a C Web dev DSL. Using a framework over a DSL makes no sense.

[jtreminio]

Of course it makes sense, because you're not writing C code - you're writing PHP.

A framework is simply a pre-packaged organization of your code. In the case of the mini php frameworks, they provide little more than a router.

I have worked on many projects - those with and without frameworks. I will choose code on a framework any day of the week.