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by bazillion 4840 days ago
Honestly, probably one of the best things you could do is join the military. If you are tech savvy, then chances are that you can score high enough on the ASVAB (entry test) in order to get into a really high speed career field. I joined the Navy, became an arabic linguist, left after a few years, and got a programming job as a contractor for 102k/year. Here's the process you're looking at if you want to take a similar route:

1) See your local (you might have to travel a bit) recruiting station and ask to start the process in joining. I recommend the Navy of all branches, because I've worked with people of all the other branches and the Navy gives you the most potential to succeed long-term -- they are the only ones that promote the idea of cross-training, will burn away your outer weakness by some extremely crappy years of work ultimately making you a better person, and allow you more technological opportunities than any other branch.

2) Your recruiter will ask you about your past. This will include drug use, prior convictions, etc. Hopefully you don't have any felony charges, or you won't be able to join. There are waivers for various offenses, but some will preclude you from getting a security clearance job.

3) Take the ASVAB. It is an extremely simple test which tests very basic concepts that you should already have formed a mental model about if you're a halfway decent programmer. Example: This lamp post is 30 feet tall and casts a 50 foot shadow -- What is the hypotenuse? (That was a real question). There are also mechanical things (what type of wrench is this?) and basic english things. Score in the 80+ range (out of a possible 99...which I maxed out without breaking a sweat and I'm not a genius) and you can almost guarantee yourself a security clearance job.

4) Your recruiter will take you to a MEPS station. After they do a bunch of physical tests on you (normal physician tests like stripping you down and checking your parts), you will be taken to the most important leg of the journey -- the guy that will assign you your rating. If you did well on your ASVAB, this part will be a breeze, because he will mostly be interested in fitting you in to where you're comfortable. As a programmer, your goal is to get one of these ratings in order to get yourself into a job that can leverage your skills. Even though I was an arabic linguist, I was allowed to build unlimited amounts of tools in order to support missions, and that eventually just became my job. I was in the military and could come in to work whenever I wanted to and basically do whatever I wanted to. This is the exception more than the rule, however, but it's still a possibility if you have an excellent work ethic. The jobs that get you into said positions are: CTI, CTT, CTN, CTR, IT (secure). All of these will require a 6 year obligation (4 year + 2 year extension).

5) Boot camp. It was basically one of the more enjoyable periods of my life. Every day is mapped out on a bi-hourly basis about what you're going to be doing from the minute you get there to the minute you graduate. You can look on the schedule and see what you're going to be doing 2 hours and 4 weeks later, and that will be exactly what you'll be doing. The structure will allow you find out things about yourself and your capabilities which you might not be aware of. I had barely graduated high school (1.8 gpa) and had a couple months of work at subway, but the experience awakened a great motivation to succeed in me, and it just might do the same for you too.

6) A-School. Depending on the rating (job) you chose, this will be different. For the non-CTI jobs, you'll be going to lovely (sarcasm) Pensacola, FL. The experience is great, and it's a good stepping stone to re-introduce you back into the world after having everything taken away from you in boot camp. If you chose CTI then you'll be going to the Defense Language Institute (DLI). It's basically college, except you're paid to go. Would recommend.

7) C-School -- most likely still in Pensacola if you're a non-CTI, and if you're a CTI it will just be at your final duty station. This will be where you learn more advanced things, and will be influenced by your scores on tests in A school. The great part about this is that there's no homework since everything is classified, which is why I was able to do really well here. Only knowledge and practical ability matters (which is the common theme that you'll find in most of the Navy).

8) Final duty station. This can be many places around the world, but if you specifically want to program then you want to be stationed at an NSA facility. The NSA is the only government agency that really promotes people to think outside the box -- trust me, I've worked at all of the others. I never programmed anything for real until I went there, and there was a program we used where you had to add the number 9 to a calculation before entering it in. I asked "shouldn't the computer just do that?" and no matter how many trouble tickets we submitted, no one would resolve it. So, I asked the person who had created the program 20 years ago if I could modify the program to fix it -- he handed me the Perl cookbook and said go for it. That spawned an entire career. You'll find that people there, although odd, will be more open to change than anywhere else in the government.

Once you have 6 years in (which will be the minimum for a job like this), you'll be 28/29 with a lot of skills, experience, and a security clearance. You'll have met people working at various contracting companies that will hire you, or you can apply at various government agencies that will easily snatch you up.

About me: I started out as an EW (electronic warfare technician) tech which was 2 years of electronics schooling. I served on a ship for 2 years and cross-rated to CTI to learn arabic. After finishing 9 years total in the Navy, I collected a total of 62,000 dollars in bonus money. I left the Navy with no debt, a car, a lot of money in the bank, a 92k offer and a 102k offer and three full months of collecting my Navy paycheck after leaving (terminal pay). I took the higher job offer and worked that for a year, conceiving of, writing the requirements for, and building (by myself) a computer program that saved the government an estimated 3 million dollars (along with writing a bunch of piddly scripts and API's that have saved a few million more and continue to be used). I'm 29 now and have saved up enough money that I dont have to work for 2 years and can focus on bootstrapping my own startup. The Navy and my work ethic (and ability to save money) gave me that, and it can give it to you too.

If you'd like more information, message me and I'd be glad to help.

5 comments

I almost joined the navy right out of high school. I went through much of the recruiting process, but ultimately decided against it. For me, that was one of the best decisions of my life. For you, you should consider it, but give a lot of thought to it before you even start the recruiting process. Military recruiters will lie to you and your family (maybe not all of them, but it happened to me) to make sure you join and if you don't have a lot of determination to exit the recruiting process, you will likely get sucked in even if you change your mind.
My first chief, who is a great inspiration in my life, was once a recruiter. I asked him how he felt about recruiting, and if he had to lie to get people to join. His response was this:

"I never had to lie to anyone about joining the military. The secret is that no one walks into my office if everything is going right in their life. I just find what that problem is, and figure out how the military can solve it."

Recruiters can't effectively tell you lies if you know everything you need to know. In my case, my father had been a sonar tech and had told me what to expect like what I posted up there -- I already knew what I was getting into when I walked into that office. Don't go to a recruiter (and potentially waste their time) if you haven't done the due diligence to research a very life-changing decision.

Some recruiters will tell you flat-out lies. I had three (two from one branch, one from another) try to convince me that breaking my arm twice as a youth wasn't worth telling the processors. The pair that tag-teamed me were conveniently ignoring the framed statement in their very office that said that lying about anything during your recruitment process was a violation of the UCMJ.

I really hope those three guys were in the minority, but it left a bad taste in my mouth.

It's very important that everything medical before and during your career is documented. First off, a lot of the physical and mental stress down the road can exacerbate previous conditions and lead to more major problems. Secondly, everything that occurs and is documented in your military health record can be treated for free by any VA medical facility for the rest of your life, even if you don't have health insurance.

That being said, certain common diagnoses will preclude you from entering service: ADD/ADHD, bi-polar disorder, bad knees, fibromyalgia, among other things. Obesity is kind of a no-brainer thing -- there's a maximum body fat percentage and height/weight ratio.

If it's in your health record right now, then it should definitely be declared, in my opinion. You'd only be doing yourself a disservice later on by not doing so.

Yes, I absolutely agree with this. Too many people rush into life-changing decisions like this. It's also nice to hear another perspective on recruiters. Mine really did lie to my parents, however. We met with my parents, he told them one thing, then we left to go back to the recruiting office and he said "what I told your parents wasn't true, I just didn't think they would say yes otherwise".
It's a common thing when you're in the military to toss around disparaging comments about the person that recruited you. Personally, everything my recruiter had said was true:

"When they ask you if you want to be a Nuc, say no." -- he could have got a lot of good will at his recruiting office if I chose to be a nuclear tech, but he was absolutely right in telling me this. They never came to ask me, because I had never taken algebra in high school.

"If you have a choice between an east coast and west coast ship, choose west coast." -- Absolutely agree with this. West coast is a much more relaxed attitude compared to east coast, unless you're forward deployed.

"In bootcamp, get the yeoman job." -- I listened to him and was able to get the division yeoman job. This allowed me to travel around base by myself -- something you'd appreciate if you've been through the bootcamp experience. It also led to me getting a meritorious promotion (only 2 or so recruits per division of like 30-50 got this), and getting promoted earlier decreases the amount of time required for you to advance to the next rank.

"Run a lot before you go to bootcamp". Ironically, he was a very slow runner, but I took his advice and worked out nearly daily for the two months before I left. At the time, in order to pass the run test and graduate from bootcamp you were required to run 1.5 miles in 12:15, which would have been nigh impossible for me had I not practiced a bunch beforehand. I eventually got it down to 10:25 in bootcamp, which is a decently admirable run time. Women get approx. an extra minute longer.

I could see how that's the case. If you're referring to what I said, you'll note that I said nothing about my own recruiter other than that he lied to my parents to increase the chances of them agreeing to let me go, because I was a minor. Which he admitted to doing.
That sounds nice, but what about the actual military stuff, where you actually have to participate in war? Surely that is the biggest caveat of using the military as a self-improvement exercise.

That and being stuck in there for X years. Sounds like you lucked out with your military career but it seems like more the exception than the rule?

Very nice counter to my brief rant (not that you intended it to be). Well said. Except for the language and particular rate, my experience was essentially similar to what you describe.

I would add, though, that it doesn't necessarily go the way the recruiter describes. Yeah, if you take the tests and sign the six years, it will likely go that way, but it is the military, they do own you, and if they want to they can have you do anything because they said so. And you don't get to quit.

The military was a positive experience for me, and it is for many people. But I stand by my rant.

This is a great option for a lot of people. Glad to see you posted this. Spend 4 years in the military and you leave with great experience, have learned how to "work hard", you're respected by your peers and future employers plus you likely have a bunch of money in savings. Really wonderful option for the right people.
I wish I had gotten good, detailed advice like this 25 yrs ago. <sigh> If only. :-(