[throwaway0321]

@knowtheory The person being fired is a direct consequence of her tweet. While it isn't likely she directly intended for anyone to lose their jobs, it is equally unlikely she expected absolutely nothing to come of it.

Edit: changed wording.

[throwaway0321]

It's simple, really. You start at the result - the termination of someone's job - and work backwards. The first action thats absence changes the result is a direct cause of the result.

A direct result of the tweet is the termination of the employee. Without the tweet the parties involved wouldn't be identifiable, and no one would have lost their job.

Is the joke a direct cause of the firing? No. Many subsequent actions must take place to get from the joke to the firing. The joke isn't even required in the sequence of events. Because tweeting a picture of someone and labeling them a sexist is enough to get them fired from a certain employer.

[revdinosaur]

I think it's fascinating that every single instance of this argument, in this and related threads, posters conveniently decide to begin tracing the chain of events that lead to the firing at the tweet--not the jokes.

[jcc80]

Maybe the part you're missing is that the jokes aren't the unusual part. Just run of the mill banter between a couple guys when maybe they should have been quiet so they weren't distracting people from listening. Tweeting a photo to shame people at a conference is highly unusual. Getting offended at a dongle joke not directed at you is highly unusual. That's why the story normally starts there.

Not trying to be a jerk - if you feel the jokes are somehow unique or offensive. Most people just don't see it that way though.

[revdinosaur]

I'm sorry but you're incorrect. Getting "offended" by a sexual joke is not unusual, nor does its normalcy matter in this situation. What they did was create an unwelcoming environment around them by engaging in locker room-level humor.

I personally am not offended by the joke nor do I think they are clever or unique, but saying that they don't matter because they're the status quo is a really weak argument and it speaks to the lack of progressive thought in this community when it comes to diversity.

[jcc80]

Lack of progressive thought on diversity? If you want an argument about dongle jokes creating an unwelcoming environment look elsewhere. The most sensitive among us don't set the rules. https://amandablumwords.wordpress.com/2013/03/21/3/

[revdinosaur]

I think everyone following this has read the article you linked, and you have a valid point. But I think that you are in error if you're endorsing the idea that because something is normal or happens often (like casual banter between males) that it is inherently non-harmful.

The tone of conversations between other males often repels me, but the reaction to calling them out for it is worse often then simply putting up with it, as Adria Richards is experiencing. The focus is shifted to examining the complainant rather than truly evaluating the matter at hand. It's extremely unfortunate to witness or experience and is undeniably regressive in my opinion.