[alpatters]

You're a professional programmer, you use a keyboard all day, so you touch type right? hjkl sits right on the home row, where your fingers sit. It is just a natural place to put movement keys. Nothing to do with the number of keys on the authors keyboard.

Like you say when your jumping around a lot then it matters less. When you're typing a lot then it does matter to keep your fingers on the home row.

[robomartin]

> You're a professional programmer, you use a keyboard all day, so you touch type right? hjkl sits right on the home row, where your fingers sit. It is just a natural place to put movement keys. Nothing to do with the number of keys on the authors keyboard.

And my point is that it does not matter. Use the mouse. Use the arrow keys. Use the function keys. Use a GUI. Use multiple monitors.

If we are talking about productivity and code quality, the editor is orders of magnitude less significant than a huge list of other things. It does not matter.

Then we have someone now saying "don't use the hjkl" keys. Really? How far is the idiocy going to go?

If I am building a business or a product the last thing on my mind is what text editor we will be using. It is so ridiculously insignificant in the grand scheme of things that seeing people focus on it is beyond comprehension.

[macalicious]

Seriously, I can't stop but think while reading your comments that you have a lot of emotions building up within you.

I see your point in people evangelizing VIM, Emacs, Apple, whatsoever, but... who cares? Let them be. I don't see, why you try so hard to prevent people from being happy and enjoy little things in life. Why does everything have to be insignificant, because something else is so much more significant? I seriously don't get your point there.

Let people love their editor, even if it is insignificant to you. People actually are more productive, when they are happy using a product they like, or could you seriously imagine writing code/surfing the web/do anything with the on-screen keyboard? Even you would get frustrated and would hate your job. It does matter. Maybe not the productivity-wise, but definitely how you, as a person, feel.

[robomartin]

Well, it's possible that you are confusing passion with emotion. It really takes a thick skin to go against the grain. The grain on HN is very pro-vim for some reason. And, yes, it blew my top to see an article now proposing to go farther and ignore "hjkl". How insane will this cult get?

If all I achieve is to virtually snap a newbie out of the trance created by HN dogma the result is good. It would be a tragedy to promote these tools for another thirty years.

[lutusp]

> ... the editor is orders of magnitude less significant than a huge list of other things. It does not matter.

The first point is true. The second point is false -- it does matter. Saying that X is less important than Y can't be used to argue that X doesn't matter at all.

> If I am building a business or a product the last thing on my mind is what text editor we will be using. It is so ridiculously insignificant in the grand scheme of things that seeing people focus on it is beyond comprehension.

That's true in general, but there's an exception -- if you can improve the efficiency of editing, you might make a basic change in people's thinking and become a millionaire as a side effect.

Guess how I know this.

[robomartin]

I think that the value of your editor was not in efficiency --if we define it as "data entry speed". I think it had a lot more to do with a sensible user interface that was accessible and yes, "efficient", for someone --anyone-- to get into. It used that peripherals and accepted UI norms available at the time and it did so well enough to be successful.

vim is a cult based on metrics that are not significant drivers in the context of building a software product or company.

[lutusp]

> I think that the value of your editor was not in efficiency --if we define it as "data entry speed".

Oh, I agree -- based on modern standards it was quite primitive and somewhat poky when used by an experienced touch-typist. But I was only comparing it to vi. :)