[krapp]

The civil rights movement was important, but there were places in the world at the time where black people could walk into the same restaurant as whites. The end of colonialism was important, if you were Indian. The Vietnam war was important, but then again, World War 2 was important, and so was World War 1, and so was Hannibal crossing the Alps.

With the moon landing, for the first time human beings were able to view our world objectively, in the third person, by having stood on another one. Seeing the moon landings on television changed people's lives. Seeing photos of the earthrise changed people's lives. It was a global event, it was universal. Yes, it was wrapped up in Cold War politics and no it didn't end any wars but ... we stood on another world for the first time.

If that's not a watershed moment in civilization then what was?

[vacri]

You're speaking a lot of romance. "we stood on another world for the first time"... and shortly after, we packed up and went home, never to return. Sure, it was a milestone in human history, but it's not like it really changed the way our societies work. Please give some examples of some fundamental changes if you disagree - "Seeing the moon landings on television changed people's lives": How? What was new in the way we conduct our civilisation?

Edit: I also find it weird that you're characterising the social effects and fallout of WW2 as being less powerful in terms of civilisation change than a photo from the moon. Really, this is just geek romance talking.

[krapp]

>You're speaking a lot of romance.

Epic events tend to lend themselves to romantic speech. I would stand on a soapbox but then my keyboard would be awkward to reach, and they don't make soapboxes anymore, except out of cardboard.

>and shortly after, we packed up and went home, never to return. True. That doesn't at all negate the impact of the initial event though. Just means one we got to the moon we discovered it was dirt, dirt and more dirt.

>Sure, it was a milestone in human history, but it's not like it really changed the way our societies work.

I'm not arguing that it necessarily changed the way our societies work, just the terms by which humanity could view its own potential. Before, we weren't a species capable of landing someone on the moon. Afterwards, we were.

I'd have no problem putting the advent of the World Wide Web up in the same category as the moon landing, or even ahead of it using your terms, but that still doesn't put Google in the same class as either, in terms of technology or revolutionary achievement. Yet. Glass may, indeed end up pushing the envelope of human interaction somewhere incredible and transformational. Or maybe it's just a gimmicky new UI. I don't know. But I guarantee fifty years from now nobody's going to be telling their grandchildren where they were when Google came out with anything unless at some point Google becomes responsible for strong AI or maybe a working teleporter.

>Seeing the moon landings on television changed people's lives": How?

They saw people landing on the moon on television. Live(ish).

>Edit: I also find it weird that you're characterising the social effects and fallout of WW2 as being less powerful in terms of civilisation change than a photo from the moon. Really, this is just geek romance talking.

I'm not. I'm suggesting that there weren't other, prior examples of being able to see the Earth from standing on another planet. It was a unique event, and its impact (however you choose to measure it) was likewise unique. Wars are not unique events, and my other point was their impact is bound by politics and geography, whereas the moon landing and the picture of earthrise wasn't.

And yes perhaps it is a bit of geek romance talking. It's also a bit of geek romance to suggest that Google is more important in social and technological terms than the moon landing. My geek romanticism just happens to look a bit further back.

[rayiner]

My dad remembers watching the moon landing in Bangladesh, and someone commenting on how it couldn't be possible because "you can't punch a hole in the sky." I don't think he could tell you when he switched from Altavista to Google.

[vacri]

A friend's grandmother told the story of doing laundry in Malta as a young girl, and dreaming with her friends, wishing that there was some sort of 'magic box' you could throw the clothes in, press a button, and have them come out clean.

When the washing machine came out where she was - even though it's an utterly boring item to all of us - it massively changed how she lived her life.

[vacri]

So, when asked "how it's changed people's lives", the best you can come up with is "they watched it on TV"? That's one of the most banal examples possible of 'changing lives'.

But I guarantee fifty years from now nobody's going to be telling their grandchildren where they were when Google came out with anything

Which is part of the romantic thing, not the merit thing. I can tell you where I was when Lady Di died, but that doesn't mean she was of any particular note in my life :)

I'm not arguing that it necessarily changed the way our societies work

This is exactly what "watershed moments of civilization" means. If you didn't actually mean that, then we've got little to debate, really.

[krapp]

No, you're right.

Seeing humans walk on the moon changed people's lives in the same way seeing 9/11 on tv changed people's lives, or seeing JFK get shot on tv changed people's lives. In that it was a monumental, historic and transfixing event.

Not at all like the first time you opened maps and saw street view.

I concede the point.

[vacri]

I asked how it changed lives, and you said "they saw it on TV". Nothing indicating what people now did once that event had passed.

As opposed to mapping, which doesn't wow you as much when you see it - it's not entertainment - but has made significant changes to the way people conduct their lives. People do things that they didn't do before because of maps. The moon shot, while an event in itself, yes, didn't in itself change the way people relate and interact.

Also, I was far more wowed when I first saw street view than when I first saw JFK's assassination. Prominent politicians have been assasssinated at least as far back as Julius Caesar, but showing me a picture of just about any street location in the developed world? That's something new, interesting, ambitious, and yes, even life-changing. I've seen people use it regularly to find out what their destination looks like before they set out, to make it easier to find where they are. JFK was just another head of state getting shot. Big event, sure, but hardly something new or original like you seem to be demanding here.