[Permit]

>Guns are our only defense against the next Trotsky, Stalin, Lennin or Mao once again purging a 100 million of their own people.

Even though I support gun control, I recognize that there are many good reasons that people in opposition of gun control put forward.

This is certainly not one of them.

If the government decided to steam roll your town, you'd have as much hope at defending yourself against them as the citizens of Iraq would. Small arms are not particularly effective against drones and armored vehicles.

[thuffy]

Clearly the tyrants of today disagree with you. They would not be trying so desperately to ban guns if they did not fear an armed population!

Also,

In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915-1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

In 1929 the Soviet Union established gun control. From 1929 to 1953, over 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, 13 million Jews, gypsies, homosexuals, the mentally ill, and others, who were unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, over 50 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million "educated" people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

That places total victims who lost their lives because of gun control at approximately 86 million in the last century. Since we should learn from the mistakes of history, the next time someone talks in favor of gun control, find out which group of citizens they wish to have exterminated.

[Permit]

>Clearly the tyrants of today disagree with you. They would not be trying so desperately to ban guns if they did not fear an armed population!

I can't tell if you're serious. The world isn't out to get you. We've had sensible restrictions on guns in Canada for some time now without a resulting genocide.

Is it so hard for you to believe that one might want guns banned for reasons other than the oppression of fellow citizens? As a citizen I have nothing to gain by banning guns. If I became a politician and offered the same position, I'd be called a scheming tyrant by individuals like yourself.

Bizarre. Your comments remind me of: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/story/2012/08/08/calga... Perhaps the attitudes of Canadians and Americans differ more on this issue than I initially thought.

[_dps]

Your factual observation is correct, but I don't think the parent is suggesting that the absence of weapons guarantees genocide. I believe the claim is that weapons provide a deterrent to genocide.

To relate to your example: Canada may have merely "gotten lucky" in not yet having had a genocidal leader. If I had to pick among two competing theories:

Theory 1) An armed populace can deter genocide. The observed fact is because Canada hasn't yet had a leader inclined to genocide, or influential enough to accomplish it.

Theory 2) An armed populace cannot deter genocide.

I'd be inclined to believe the first. The policy implications of such a belief would, of course, depend on the general likelihood of leaders prone to genocide. If they are vanishingly rare, then the benefits of deterrence are probably outweighed by the costs of widely distributed arms. The history of twentieth century states leaves this, for me, an open question.

[n3rdy]

Not to mention that an armed United States is a reasonable deterrent that would undermine any attempt at genocide in Canada.

The moment it was clear that the Canadian government intended to begin mass executions, activists from the U.S would start moving weapons and other provisions over the border to assist a resistance. This is assuming that the U.S government didn't send its own military to stop the genocide itself.

[phpnode]

Yours is such a wilfully ignorant post, I'm not sure where to begin, or even if it's worth replying...

How do you explain the countless genocides in countries where guns are or were freely available? What about the Soviet dissidents that were exterminated before 1929? Would widespread availability of guns have prevented the holocaust - of course not!

It is the people that have the power to prevent genocide, not guns.

[thinkdevcode]

>> It is the people that have the power to prevent genocide, not guns.

people with guns

[kaonashi]

Wow, we're seriously recycling right-wing e-mail forwards on HN now?

[n3rdy]

> Even though I support gun control, I recognize that there are many good reasons that people in opposition of gun control put forward.

The problem with this train of thought is that gun control is enforced by gun violence.

Good people who just want to have weapons to defend themselves will be forced at gunpoint to surrender their weapons, and if they resist, they will be shot.

What is the difference between armed police officers and armed civilians? The most obvious would be the badge and uniform, but then you would think experience would follow, but it doesn't. Civilians are more experienced with their weapons than police officers are.

Just look at the problems the NYPD have been causing. It's alarming how many of these police officers don't spend any time at a gun range practicing, this is how 9 innocent people get shot by the police.

If you are eating at a diner and an armed man comes in with a gun screaming that he's going to start shooting everybody, you are going to be thankful to the civilian who is carrying his own weapon and prevents anyone from being harmed, you will not be thinking "I can't believe that regular looking guy had a gun on him this whole time, if that lunatic never came in here, I would have never known.. somebody needs to pass a law to stop that!"