[imoverclocked]

> CD-ROM media

Wow, I just learned that I can still buy a pack of new CD-RW discs. This is an almost 30 year old format that is still published for!

Long live ATAPI!

Seriously though, why still publish CD formats when a usb-stick is far more ubiquitous and much easier to actually write. Are there systems that can boot CD-ROM interfaces that don't have USB boot capability still?

[bilegeek]

> Are there systems that can boot CD-ROM interfaces that don't have USB boot capability still?

New x64 systems? Probably not. But since it still supports x86 and a whole slew of other architectures[1] still that don't always, it probably wouldn't make sense to stop.

[1]https://www.netbsd.org/ports/

[bpye]

NetBSD supposedly supports 486, I don't think you're going to have much luck with USB there.

[accrual]

There are some ISA USB cards with custom drivers to support them and present them as normal drives under MS-DOS. Never tried it myself, but they exist and seem to work!

Other commenter is correct, there are some late 486 boards with PCI support that would allow USB 1.0 or even 2.0 cards to be installed and used. Probably slow, but should work.

On the topic of modernizing a 486-class machine, there also exist a few with native PS/2 mouse support, and certain Matrox PCI cards have digital out, so it'd be possible to build a 486-class machine with USB 1.1, DVI/HDMI, and PS/2.

Since some Logitech wireless mice support PS/2, one could connect a 486 rig to a crisp digital LCD, use a wireless mouse, and plug in USB flash drives, sound, 10/100 network, NT 4.0, etc. -- all supported. Can make a fairly "modern" machine out of a pre-Pentium chip.

[hakfoo]

I did a lot of work on a custom option ROM for the ISA USB card type you mention. It exposes an INT 13h interface, so systems that access discs through the BIOS will work (DOS, probably CP/M-86 or ELKS, Minix might require you to specify BIOS disc access). More sophisticated operating systems that directly poke the IDE registers are not going to find what they're looking for.

[AAAAaccountAAAA]

Some higher-end 486 boards[1] were made with PCI slots, so retrofitting them with an USB controller shouldn't be difficult? You'll still need a boot floppy to actually boot from an USB drive, I think?

1. https://theretroweb.com/motherboards/s/asus-pvi-486sp3

[prmoustache]

It is still easier to find cdr than floppies anyway. I can still find some in brick and mortar supermarkets. Still useful when you have an old car and want to keep the original audio system.

[Retr0id]

One thing ISOs are useful for is installation under a hypervisor, or BMC. You can usually do the exact same thing with USB images, but a lot of the UI/workflows are oriented around .iso files.

[chungy]

> Seriously though, why still publish CD formats when a usb-stick is far more ubiquitous and much easier to actually write.

You can make ISO images that boot fine from both CD and USB sticks, when written to either format. Why "Fix" something that ain't broke?

[yjftsjthsd-h]

> Seriously though, why still publish CD formats when a usb-stick is far more ubiquitous and much easier to actually write. Are there systems that can boot CD-ROM interfaces that don't have USB boot capability still?

NetBSD literally maintains support for VAX. Your mental model of expected hardware isn't exactly wrong in the general case, but it's also not exactly applicable here.

[Narishma]

NetBSD even supports installing from floppies on old systems if you don´t have a CD-ROM drive.

[thisislife2]

I am guessing, but many of us still use CDs / DVDs (/BluRays?) to make backups. It's cheap. Lasts long.

[sellmesoap]

Write once has some security benefits as well!

[alt227]

> Lasts long

My CD backups lasted about 10-12 years before the silver started peeling off the discs :(

[thisislife2]

Yeah, learnt the hard way to have backups in multiple medias and that you have to refresh / re-copy your backups every 4-5 years. Wish we had consumer tape drives so that it could be once every 10 years or so.

[cosmic_cheese]

Flash storage can’t sit on the shelf without bitrot as long as CD-R and DVD-R can, even though writable optical media itself isn’t the best for durability.

CD-RW/DVD+RW on the other hand are also even worse than flash in that regard and decay very quickly in my experience.

[saghm]

> Seriously though, why still publish CD formats when a usb-stick is far more ubiquitous and much easier to actually write. Are there systems that can boot CD-ROM interfaces that don't have USB boot capability still?

I mean, you could also ask "why use NetBSD when Linux or even Windows is much more ubiquitous and much easier to install?", but I feel like that would be missing the point. Once you're off the beaten path, you have to update your priors a bit about how likely it is to need to support something that isn't as common.

[jmclnx]

>Are there systems that can boot CD-ROM interfaces that don't have USB boot capability still?

Old Systems. I have one such system that will is in line to move to 11.0 from 9.3. To do that I will boot from CDROM. It does not have any USB ports.

NetBSD is probably the only UN*X Type OS that can run on many of these 32 bit systems. Plus the NetBSD team is doing their best to support these old systems.

That saves me $ and helps the environment a little bit :)

[imoverclocked]

> That saves me $ and helps the environment a little bit :)

Seems like a tradeoff with power though. Even emulating hardware from that era is more power efficient than actually running it. Of course, if you have custom ISA cards or something then you are likely stuck :)

[sellmesoap]

I don't know about the progression of PSU efficiency, but 32bit desktops were rocking 250-400w PSUs and modern desktops would be hard to find one less then 650w so sure maybe we're more efficient for the amount of compute/W but running flat out will still hit your pocketbook harder on a modern system.

[cosmic_cheese]

I’m in favor of repurposing old machines, but for a lot of the use cases they serve would be more than adequately filled by those little mobile CPU mini-PCs and Mac Mini’s which can go as low as 2-15W and top out somewhere around 60-110W.

[bitwize]

Blit the iso to a usb stick and boot it. If your PC is recent (made in the past 15-20 years or so), it'll understand it just fine.

[imoverclocked]

> If you are using flash-based media (e.g. a USB drive), please use the .img files rather than the .iso images.

I have done that in the past but there are already .img files specifically for USB. Seems redundant.

[Narishma]

Both are needed for different use cases. That they overlap for some use cases doesn't make them redundant.