[supriyo-biswas]

Farming is a necessary activity and in most countries, they are also a politically influential group.

The case for data centers in the age of AI is weaker, and the only effects for the average person are noise, pollution, higher electricity costs, higher water costs, for the ultimate "benefit" of losing your job.

[arjie]

The necessity of alfalfa exports from water-scarce US states is certainly not obvious. Why do you believe this is essential?

[throwaway2037]

    > alfalfa exports from water-scarce US states

Which states are those?

[hvb2]

Arizona...

https://floodlightnews.org/saudi-owned-corporate-farms-are-d...

[messe]

California for one.

[throwaway2037]

California is not water-scarce. It has plenty of water in the north and mountains to the east.

[wookmaster]

They're growing it in the south Central Valley, not the north and not the east mountains. Though assuming you're referring to snowpack in the mountains and not looking to pump the lakes dry its completely dependent on the years precipitation.

[xahrepap]

Utah

[bsder]

I'm all about stomping on the agribusiness water usage and think that whole swathes of agribusiness in CA should get shut down.

However, as I understand it, the alfalfa is a soil restorer that the agribusinesses are going to grow anyway. The question is whether there is any benefit to forcing the agribusinesses plow it under vs exporting it.

[caymanjim]

They're not going to grow it if they can't sell it, nor are they going to grow it if the water stops being free. We shouldn't be growing alfalfa, for export, in the desert, with free water, and subsidizing the farmers on top of it to encourage even more of it.

It's nothing more than purchasing votes with tax dollars and limited natural resources.

[bsder]

Please reread my statement:

> the alfalfa is a soil restorer

So, yes, the agribusinesses WILL grow that alfalfa even if they can't sell it.

Now, you can factually dispute me since I am by no means a California agribusiness expert. However, it is my understanding that alfalfa is uniquely suited to the soil restoration required for the agribusinesses to cycle their fields more quickly.

It is also my understanding that part of the reason why alfalfa can be shipped so cheaply is because you need to return shipping containers back to origin to ship something else and those containers would be empty otherwise.

So, this is a perfect storm of alfalfa that would be grown anyway only to be plowed under being too expensive to ship except for the fact that the shipping is almost free due to the containers being returned to origin.

[abosley]

But the water. What about the water necessary to "restore the soil". The soil in question of course, was non-productive desert 50 years ago. We are doing input intensive farming in areas where the complex supply chain necessary to support is causing what some people call "externalities". Others, the tragedy of the commons. Well run societies try to use regulation to keep this from happening.

[bsder]

Those are two different and separate arguments.

"We shouldn't be growing anything out there." is an argument that the agribusinesses don't want to have.

"We shouldn't be growing alfalfa out there." is a nice distraction argument that the agribusinesses are happy to have because it concedes that we should be farming the area.

[theshrike79]

California farms some very non-essential things like Pistachios, that take insane amounts of water to grow. In what's effectively a desert.

[smcin]

Yes, and during the declared drought of 2020-3.