[paxys]

> If someone doesn’t have $400 to buy out the residual then I doubt they would have had the cash to pay for the whole thing up front.

That’s the entire point. They would have bought a cheaper phone, or held on to their old one, but are now paying perpetual monthly payments.

There’s a reason car dealerships never ask “how much can you afford”, but “how much do you want to pay every month”.

There’s a reason Klarna is running the program for them.

[br0wnr1c3]

I think this is exactly right — when the options on the table are: - iPhone 17 (~$800) - iPhone 17 Pro Max (~$1200)

a person may reasonably make the choice that they don't need the Pro Max and buy the regular 17.

Now, when the options are: - iPhone 17 ($23/month) - iPhone 17 Pro Max ($35/month)

$12/month extra doesn't seem too bad, except the fact that after 24 months you can't afford to keep the phone and are effectively forced to upgrade to a new iPhone.

I agree that more options are generally better for consumers, but these types of leasing programs are predatory and come at a time when everything is becoming a subscription.

[Spooky23]

What if I don’t want to “own my phone”?

Look, I have one camera with me and one child. As long as the camera gets better every year, I’m gonna want a better camera, every year. I don’t want to deal with carriers and trade-in shopping. Unfortunately this particular deal sucks compared tot he old one.

I’m not financially irresponsible. I value these devices highly and value my time.

[spaqin]

No one's really stopping you from owning nothing and being happy.

[Spooky23]

They did - they turned a 24 month loan/AppleCare that you could re-swizzle with a new phone and exchange the device on the same terms (except the cost delta for the phone) to a shitty leasing arrangement that costs 25% more.

[adamtaylor_13]

> That’s the entire point. They would have bought a cheaper phone

This kinda sounds like, "We should make it hard for people to make poor financial decisions." Which seems like an answer completely orthogonal to the problem at hand.

[pwagland]

What is the problem at hand?

How to get customers to make poor financial decisions? How to sell more phones to people that can't really afford them?

Seriously, what is the problem that is being solved?

[Aurornis]

You know those financially irresponsible people don’t need this program, right? They would have used a credit card to buy it with much worse terms

You seem tilted at Apple for offering a financing option, but your real gripe is apparently with some people who have poor financial decision making skills. Those people could (and probably would) do a lot worse with traditional options like a credit card.

Can we at least compare apples to apples (hah) and look at the actual terms of the program here? Honestly they're not bad, and I say that as someone who leans toward purchasing outright.

[apparent]

> You know those financially irresponsible people don’t need this program, right? They would have used a credit card to buy it with much worse terms

I thought of this also. The question is whether they will now spend even more on the phone since they won't be paying as much in interest. If so, it's savvy of Apple to suck up that difference instead of letting it go to credit card companies.

Presumably Klarna's share is lower because Apple is rumored to be able to nerf these devices if a series of payments are missed. [1]

1: https://9to5mac.com/2026/07/21/ios-27-code-suggests-apple-co...

[ghaff]

Leasing is just a financial transaction. You need to run the numbers, evaluate the alternatives, and peer at least a bit into the future. I've never leased a car and I doubt I'd lease a phone if only to keep my options open. (At the moment, I'm in the situation where I trashed an older phone on a hiking trip so I'll probably upgrade my iPhone 15 Pro sooner than I otherwise would just so I have a usable backup while traveling again.)

[edoceo]

From that lens this is a better option for the "buyer" (renter). Cause revolving credit is >10%, sometimes even more than 15%!

[ChrisMarshallNY]

15%?

Oh, sweet summer child...

https://wallethub.com/answers/cc/highest-credit-card-interes...

[ghaff]

Those numbers aren't typical but it's still the case that credit cards generally have significantly higher interest rates if you don't pay in full by the due date than just about any other sort of loan (that admittedly not everyone can qualify for).

[pseudalopex]

Be kind. Don't be snarky. Edit out swipes.[1]

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

[ChrisMarshallNY]

It was a joke.

I still make jokes, even though it results in the occasional swipe from folks with deprecated sense of humor, that feel the need to take swipes at others.

> Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith.

From the above link, but this is largely ignored.

[edoceo]

Didn't even hurt my feelings, nor was it snarky (to me). My g-ma said that all the time.

[edoceo]

Oof.

[HeWhoLurksLate]

> They would have used a credit card to buy it with much worse terms

average credit card interest rate: 18-25% APR [0][1] average klarna effective interest rate:25-33% APR [2]

getting what are effectively individual lines of credit per-burrito or iphone is crazy work and I wouldn't recommend it most of the time. Save some money up, people!

[0] https://www.experian.com/blogs/ask-experian/research/current... [1] https://www.forbes.com/advisor/credit-cards/average-credit-c... [2] https://wealthvieu.com/debt/credit-card-debt/klarna-review/

[Aurornis]

> average klarna effective interest rate:25-33% APR [2]

> getting what are effectively individual lines of credit per-burrito or iphone is crazy work and I wouldn't recommend it most of the time.

I think this whole sub-thread has gone off track from people who aren't reading the actual terms of the Apple deal.

Nobody's talking about getting a 33% Klarna loan for an iPhone or burrito. You included 2 statistics and 3 citations that have nothing to do with the program we're talking about.

We're trying to talk about the Apple program in the link, not some other financial services complaints that people have about other things.

[nekooooo]

it's a 0% loan with a buyout at the end for 2 years though. not 33% APR.

[JumpCrisscross]

> They would have bought a cheaper phone, or held on to their old one

Or they would have just bought the new phone and sold their old one for dimes on the dollar on e.g. Gazelle.