[antonvs]

> it’s an extremely appropriate place to shame those in the profession who refuse to consider the second-order effects of their work.

The HN guidelines follow the approach which Martin Luther King Jr. criticized:

> [the] moderate who is more devoted to “order” than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice

Politeness is considered more important than holding people to account. This acts as a strong protection of the status quo, i.e. it’s fundamentally conservative.

I’ve been observing another institution which follows that approach: the US Congress and Senate. It hasn’t been working out so well.

(Side note: I had to wait a few hours to be allowed to post this comment; how many comments are abandoned for that reason, or result in people going elsewhere, leaving this site to its self-reinforcing prejudices. It’s not the discourse encourager that some people imagine it is.)

[Cider9986]

It's not hard to disagree politely. People do it all the time.

The thing you are missing is that discourse is terrible when people are rude. It's full of name calling, tone policing and moves away from the topic.

[antonvs]

I’m not missing anything. I used to use Usenet, notorious for flamewars. What you’re missing is that when you don’t try to control and nanny people, they can settle into an equilibrium on their own.

Edit: also, I find it revealing that you felt compelled to include that bit about "the thing you are missing", which is just a passive-aggressive way to call me an idiot who can't even see what you consider an obvious consequence. If you're honest with yourself, you'll admit that. I'd much rather someone be honest than fake polite.

[datsci_est_2015]

I also am a believer in many of MLK’s more “radical” messages, and find the modern whitewashing of his messaging to be deeply representative of much of America’s core moral failings, especially as it occurs in our education system.

I’m glad you brought it up here. Just because someone speaks well, intelligently, pleasantly, or even civilly doesn’t mean their message is righteous or just. Conversely, just because someone creates discomfort or says something impolite doesn’t mean their message can be disregarded. In fact, it’s those that are in power that often decide what or what is not impolite, and even speaking truth or justice to power in the first place can be labeled as impolite. George Carlin’s primary message as a comedian was essentially that.