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by codingdave 2 days ago
By what measurement? They all surely beat air conditioning in terms of energy usage.
3 comments

They are complimentary. Shutters reduce the amount of heat coming in. AC gets whatever heat managed to go in out.

One thing I'll never understand is not having shutters, only curtains. I live in France, almost everyone has shutters. But in other countries it's often different. I lived in Thailand for a couple of years and had only curtains, so the sun would still get past the window pane, heat the curtain, and the AC would then have take this heat outside again. This seemed massively inefficient.

I thing the best compromise is using whatever traditional, passive means of cooling we can, and then AC as needed.

Most of the time these things are governed by whatever's cheaper (in the short run).

Maybe electrical energy is massively subsidized or just cheap in general. Installing shutters can be a large up-front investment, especially when installed by somebody else. It may take many years of burning energy with an AC to earn that back.

Also maybe the home isn't even yours, but you are renting. The owner doesn't care about your energy bill.

I thought it was more of a cultural thing, or perhaps enforced by the building code ? Here in France I've never seen a house or flat without shutters. In Bangkok, when I was looking for a condo, none of them had shutters.

A cursory web search tells me shutters can influence the DPE ("diagnostic de performance énergétique".) A bad rating means you can't rent your property.

Bangkok being tropical, in summer the sun basically shines straight down (and some on the east and west walls in summer and winter), some N/S roof overhang and you’re set. In Northern Africa and southern Europe the sun is significantly lower and will shine straight through windows.

There’s definitely a cultural or historical component. In my experience shutters are extremely common, near universal, in southern Europe but much less so in northern. Which is a shame because a modern PVC roller shutter, well installed and with insulated slats, also does wonders in winter.

Actually, many homes in France don't have shutters. According to this article, almost half don't have any.

https://immobilier.lefigaro.fr/article/seulement-54-de-logem...

Yes I'm pretty sure that I cannot put up shutters or awnings here (in the UK) on the front of my house. These may become necessary in the years ahead.
Do shutters make it worse? How? Is it just a bad metric?
Since they’re using French for the rating, I’d think the shutters improve the score and that contributes to their pervasiveness.

From a quick search, older versions of the DPE ignored shutters, modern ones take them in account and their effect ranges from neutral to positive depending on details (materials, insulation, fit). It’s not entirely clear if both high seasons are considered (insulation and fit I’d think a lot less critical in summer).

Low-E glass in the U.S. is supposed to reduce this by blocking a significant amount of infra-red radiation.
>> While all of these might offer some cooling in your home, nothing beats air conditioning.

> By what measurement? […]

The measure of the air's temperature.

It does not matter if you have shutters: if the air outside is 30C then eventually the air inside will eventually get to 30C (good insulation will simply mean it takes longer).

If your outside is >30C then the only way to keep your inside <30C is to transfer the heat (which an AC does via an evaporator, refrigerant, and a condensor).

By the measure of "keeping the summer heat out of your home", which was in fact the topic at hand.
But that is exactly the point. Air conditioning doesn't keep heat out - it burns energy to change the air once the heat has gotten in. There are ways to keep it out in the first place.

FWIW, it isn't either/or - we practice keeping the shades, curtains, and windows drawn when it is hot, open when it is cool.... and we have air conditioning. Best of both worlds.

You’re simply never going to get through to someone who has internalized the idea that AC is perfect and free. They have accommodated to the luxury and will burn the planet to keep it.
We have more energy hitting the planet every second as radiation than we can possibly use. This is a non-issue for any civilised society switching to solar.
Going for an AC before you even have shutters or anything on the outside is like sending an audio file of you reading a pdf per email because the "record reply" button is right there, but figuring out where on the filesystem the PDF you have open on your screen would take 5 seconds. It's not about whether you can afford it or if the recipient can, but more what it says about you and your whole approach to this life thing.
By all means, install off-grid AC powered by solar on your roof. Please report on how well it goes.
Why is off-grid a requirement?

I’m in central Texas and it isn’t uncommon for rooftop solar to generate enough power to cover central a/c. Peak sun and peak a/c happen at the same time.

> But that is exactly the point. Air conditioning doesn't keep heat out - it burns energy to change the air once the heat has gotten in. There are ways to keep it out in the first place.

Yes, it's best to keep the heat out. Good insulation helps, but no insulation is perfect and eventually (thanks to the second law of thermodynamics) some will get in.