[Telaneo]

> Apple is the analog to the local electronics store. They're the ones with the direct relationship with you, they're the ones you paid, they took a 30% cut off the app developer's top line explicitly under the pretext that they handle the whole store arrangement.

Yet I can also ask Dell for a refund despite buying my Dell at my local electronics store. Both should be reachable and both should be able to give me a refund if my item is broken.

> And sure enough, they are in fact the ones who can issue a refund if you need one. The developer cannot. By design.

And Apple should fix that.

[demosthanos]

No, Dell will not give you a refund for something purchased at a retailer. For general returns and refunds, the retailer is on the hook because they're the ones who actually took your money.

What Dell will do is repair or replace a computer that is still under warranty. They won't refund.

[Telaneo]

> No, Dell will not give you a refund for something purchased at a retailer.

They're legally required to.[1]

[1] https://lovdata.no/dokument/NLE/lov/2002-06-21-34/KAPITTEL_5... Section 35

Edit: Forgot there's an English version.

[murderfs]

I don't understand how this functions in practice: if business A sells a widget to reseller B who sells it to reseller C who sells it to the customer, there's multiple layers of markup. How can the original manufacturer be expected to refund the purchase price?

Reading the law, it does not say that the consumer is entitled to a refund.

[Telaneo]

> if business A sells a widget to reseller B who sells it to reseller C who sells it to the customer, there's multiple layers of markup. How can the original manufacturer be expected to refund the purchase price?

Simple. They operate within the law and provide the customer with a refund, or they get fined. From the consumer's point of view, this is irrelevant. Business can fix this B2B issue between themselves however they wish, so long as it doesn't affect the consumer. If you don't like it, then don't do business here.

Here's a case where a consumer complained directly to the manufacturer,[1] and the Consumer Disputes Commission ruled in favour of the consumer.[2] It's not even the core of the issue, but just mentioned, since it's settled law.

> Reading the law, it does not say that the consumer is entitled to a refund.

Refunding is one possible remediation, see section 32 (cancellation) and section 26 (The consumer's rights in the event of defects). That option cancels the purchase contract, meaning you as the consumer give the item back, while the seller gives you the money you paid for the item.

[1] https://www.forbrukertilsynet.no/wp-content/uploads/2025/12/...

'Innklagde er klaget inn i kraft av å være produsent av syklene. De er følgelig ansvarlige for kjøpsrettslige mangler etter direktekravsreglene i fkjl. § 35.'

Rough translation: 'A claim is lodged against the defendant due to it being the manufacturer of the bicycles. The defendant therefore liable for for defects accordance with the rules on direct claims set out in section 35 of the Act relating to consumer purchases.'

[2] They didn't rule in favour of the consumer's demand to have the manufacturer pay for their jacket that got damaged following them falling of their broken bike. They did rule in favour of the cost of repairing the bike (a new handle bar that the consumer bought themselves to fix the issue), so the manufacturer is on the hook for that.

[murderfs]

> Refunding is one possible remediation, see section 32 (cancellation) and section 26 (The consumer's rights in the event of defects). That option cancels the purchase contract, meaning you as the consumer give the item back, while the seller gives you the money you paid for the item.

Only if the manufacturer fails to fix it per section 31: "If the defect is not rectified and no redelivery takes place pursuant to sections 29 and 30"

[Telaneo]

Correct. They get one shot at correction, and if the fault isn't gone by then, refund it is (or the seller can just jump straight to a refund if they want to). You'd be surprised how often this happens.

[demosthanos]

Fair enough, I didn't realize Norwegian law had this provision. EU-wide and US law do not, so this is pretty specific to the Nordic countries from what I can tell.

[Telaneo]

The joys of consumer protection. This one is fairly old (2002), and doesn't have any origin in any EU law, although I would have though that the EU had something roughly equivalent by now, and if they don't, they really should.