[ericmay]

> If anything, suit is boring minimalist choice, every man looks exactly like the man next to him.

It's less about the suit itself - I don't mean to imply everyone should wear the same thing. It's about the perception around it and the moaning one does when it comes to trying to present yourself in society. There's a "I don't need to impress anyone" attitude, which I'm certainly sympathetic to, but I think it is heading in the wrong direction.

It's like when you talk to a pickleball player and you ask them if they play tennis. The typical answer is "no" "that's so hard" "too much running" - it's the undercurrent of not trying and not having high standards that I take issue with. (Nothing against pickleball, truly)

[watwut]

People wear stuff to impress others without wearing suits. Suits are not even impressive looking as everyone looks the same. People feel uncomfortable and out of place in them for a host of reasons, but "I don't want to be impressive" is a rare one.

I really do not associate suits with anything you wrote here - they dont make you impressive, they dont show personalization or care about how you look like, they are just a thing you put on in rare social situation and then you feel hot. An average metal guy with a big hairstyle is putting a lot more effort into looking impressive then someone who just wears the suit.

> It's like when you talk to a pickleball player and you ask them if they play tennis. The typical answer is "no" "that's so hard" "too much running" - it's the undercurrent of not trying and not having high standards that I take issue with. (Nothing against pickleball, truly)

Is that an actual thing pickleball players and fans say or something you projected on them, because they don't play the proper tennis? Why the need to turn casual sport and exercise into a test of will and standards?

I just dont get this example either. Why is it wrong to pick a sport you can play with friends right away, have fun and then stick to it?

[ericmay]

> Suits are not even impressive looking as everyone looks the same.

You're focusing too much on the suit itself and that's causing you to miss the point.

The suit is just traditional western social attire born from military uniforms. If our traditional attire was the metal guy with big hairstyle, I'd just use that here instead. The point is trying (which of course as a death metal lover I would think the metal guy with the big hairstyle is cool) and that's what so many seem to have given up on. Wearing PJs to Wal-Mart is the decline, not the cool metal haircut.

> Is that an actual thing pickleball players and fans say or something you projected on them, because they don't play the proper tennis? Why the need to turn casual sport and exercise into a test of will and standards?

Yes, it is actual things I hear from pickleball players and my friends who play. Again though you missed the point. I think it's great that folks have fun playing pickleball or any other sport. It's not any worse or better than tennis or any other sport. The problem is the mentality from folks I've talked to. "Tennis is too hard" "Too much running". It's self-limiting, and it's an aversion to doing hard things.

That's a civilizational and social challenge we must root out.