[kybernetyk]

Let me guess: You get your groceries delivered by some underpaid sucker? While I enjoy biking it's impractical many times (if you don't live a sheltered life with people doing all the annoying stuff for you).

We have those inner city bike extremists here, too. There's proposals like banning all motorized traffic from the city because you "can walk to your bakery duh". But they never ask themselves how the baker gets all his materials to the bakery.

[BoxOfRain]

To be fair it depends so much on the city. Oxford is a great example, driving there is a hellish experience because it's a historic place with notable buildings which too important to knock down, especially in order to replace them with roads and car parks. They try to cram cars in anyway and it's just miserable. In reality the whole city centre should be pedestrianised because that's what the city is actually supposed to be designed around. Remove the private cars and buses, taxis, and yes of course delivery drivers will have plenty of room.

This perfectly legitimate argument for Oxford would be silly to make about say Milton Keynes.

[mcv]

Exactly. Amsterdam has been trying to get as many cars as possible out of the city center, and the city is that much better for it. Use your car to leave the city, but not to get to the center. There's bikes and trams for that.

[ornornor]

I own a car and a bike. I wouldn’t mind if cars were banned or very heavily restricted in the city.

I have a trailer for the bike, we can haul 100 lbs. it’s more than enough.

Businesses can be allowed to get deliveries, just personal cars are restricted.

In my city, many businesses have switched to operating from a cargo bike: plumbers, electricians, even mechanics.

[quantified]

Not very hilly? Or are they all e-bikes?

[ornornor]

E-bikes. Not super hilly but I think it’d be tiring with an acoustic bike for a business.

[nehal3m]

Depends on where they live. Groceries don’t have to be a weekly run to a far flung place to get a truck bed full of stuff. It can be a daily visit to a neighborhood supermarket on your way home. If zoning laws allow those can exist.

[kergonath]

That’s nice in principle, but it really is not the same budget around here, even though the shops are here. Small neighbourhood supermarkets and corner shops are significantly more expensive than the big supermarket that’s a 10-minute drive away.

We’re doing both: buying what we need in large quantities or with a long shelf life once a week from a supermarket and things like some meat, fruits and vegetables from the corner shop but that takes a bit of work and planning. Still, there’s money to be saved taking advantage of economies of scale.

[mcv]

Here the corner shop is a supermarket. I think I've got 5 supermarkets in a 2km radius.

[codedokode]

> But they never ask themselves how the baker gets all his materials to the bakery.

You can allow transport for business (speed-limited to 30 km/h or ~20 mph) and ban individual's cars. There are busses, trams and subway and there is no need to have a car.

[amanaplanacanal]

On the plus side professional drivers are probably better drivers than the average person, since their livelihood depends on it.

[HeyLaughingBoy]

ROFLMAO

[watwut]

I have car and rarely use it for grocerries. I walk to shop and buy stuff. I take car only rarely, when I need to go far.

The condescending assumptions people make when they dont have arguments are getting absurd.

[phoronixrly]

No, I walk 200 meters to Billa or Lidl, or less to one of the plethora of small grocery stores.

[beej71]

It won't work for everyone, but I have a bicycle trailer for food shopping. 20 minutes ride each way. I go about once a week.

[mcv]

> inner city bike extremists

WTF? In inner cities, bikes are the sensible option for 90% of traffic. Not for emergency services and larger freight of course, but it's possible to aim for a sensible mix.