[squidbeak]

Europe may face technological and economic challenges, but one thing it isn't suffering is 'an identity' crisis - except in the daydreams of right wing propagandists. The EU's identity is represented in its charter and the various treaties behind it.

> Europe becoming more reliant on the Chinese is not the answer, and will, if continues, isolate the EU from the US

There are sound reasons to avoid reliance on China, but the risk of isolation from a fading superpower - who befriends the EU's enemies, agitates in EU politics, inflict needless damage on the EU's economy, and insults EU leaders - isn't one of them.

[burnerRhodov3]

Look, i've lived in Europe for years. My wife is from switzerland. But what's with this rhetoric? It's one thing if a democratically elected president who will be out in 2 years is something you hate on... but it's turned from that. It seems every European consintely berates us, from a fundamentally level now. I won't defend trump, but what has threatening annexation of greenland done? Billions in additional military buildup, which is good for both our economies. What has threatening to leave Nato done? Billions in additional military buildup... Nato membership requires 2% of GDP to be spent on military, and until recently, very few memberstates fulfilled those requirements. Sometimes force and fear is the only way to get entities to wake up to the reality that you have a literal war on your doorstep, and you still seem to think US is your enemy. WAKE UP. We are allies, and in both world wars the American people have lost millions of lives to ensure your freedom. Russia and China are allies and Xi has said "No coorperation is forbidden between Russia and China." When China invades Taiwan, and the next world war starts, the only path forward is is for the EU and the US to REMAIN ALLIES. Don't let hate fill your heart, for things that have benefitted us both.

[squidbeak]

> Nato membership requires 2% of GDP to be spent on military.

No, actually it isn't a condition of NATO membership to spend 2% on defense. This is a myth.

> It's one thing if a democratically elected president who will be out in 2 years is something you hate on... but it's turned from that. It seems every European consintely berates us, from a fundamentally level now.

Do you think that having experienced this treatment from a nation previously trusted as a friend and ally that Europe can sensibly revert to its old confidence in the USA? Sure the Democrats might win power in 2028, or even a reformed and sensible Republican candidate. But who's to say the next populist Europhobic nutter isn't another 4 years behind them? This is the central problem for the US, that many of its citizens still won't confront: there are costs to unreliability, delinquency, bullying and threats.

> I won't defend trump, but what has threatening annexation of greenland done? Billions in additional military buildup, which is good for both our economies.

This is childishly fatuous. Europe, then, should be grateful to the US for threatening to invade it?

[bloppe]

If AfD, RN, Futuro Nazionale and their ilk stay on their current trajectory, the identity crisis will become much harder to ignore

[calgoo]

Also, don't forget how much they are medeling with the EU politics. Here in Spain the ultra right wing are following the thrump playbook step by step. Now I can't prove this, but with our current government standing up to both the US and Israel, there is a feeling that a bunch of money and "think tank" guidance is happening.

[SubiculumCode]

It's Russia and the US and EU have long been under attack.

[squidbeak]

Russia's meddling is malign. But did Russia send the USA's Vice President to Hungary to campaign on behalf of Viktor Orban?

[SubiculumCode]

maybe, who knows. but the propaganda from russia has been pervasive...and its cause people live vance and trump to get elected.

[jamiequint]

"Fading superpower" is typical EU cope. It may help to be a little bit introspective about why one might want to oppose EU politics, or its leaders, whose "leadership" over the last decade has led to unprecedented migrant, economic, and energy crises, and stalling growth.

[squidbeak]

Seeing the word 'cope' lobbed out is usually a sure sign a poster is projecting, and so it is here.

What exactly is there in the USA's destruction of the economic norms that have always served it, or in the pointless dumping of its hard-won soft power, alienation of its allies, deliberate weakening of its intelligence gatherers, rampant open corruption from its leadership, or in any other of the innumerable harms it's inflicted on itself the last 18 months, that you think is conducive to the US maintaining its superpower status?

[burnerRhodov3]

Proving superiority? Proxy controlling venezuala, creating LLM's and locking down the frontier models while GLM has to distill the models to be remotely competitive, having the hard power to ensure Iran can't fire AK's into crowds and develop nukes... I don't get how this is not percieved as immense strength? How are people defending terrorists who have been consistently saying "Death to the West"

[squidbeak]

"I can beat the shit out of the weakling in the school yard. Behold my superiority!"

[jamiequint]

"What exactly is there in the USA's destruction of the economic norms that have always served it"

What destruction? US GDP growth has recovered to the pre-COVID trendline while EU lags behind it's already-slow previous pace.

[squidbeak]

The bedrock of economic trust and co-operation that only ever served the USA's interest. What do you imagine the new coolness towards US companies or US lobbying is going to do to US GDP longterm?

You actually typify the myopia of many of Trump's supporters. "Cash in today: fuck tomorrow."

[thewebguyd]

No, fading is right. The US is willingly and deliberately ceding much of its soft power. The US also caused a global energy crisis by being so completely incompetent in their dealings with Iran in the on again off again toxic s/relationship/war

Even if the US isn't fading, the message is still clear: the country is adopting a more isolationist stance and has no problems alienating its allies. Why would you want to continue to tie yourself to a nation like that?