[otabdeveloper4]

In the sense that typesetting and text is the rabbit hole that is 90% of UI effort. Native UI frameworks don't bother fixing the real hard problems, they focus on "widgets" instead.

(Not that the web stack is a good solution to this, but at least they're making an effort and they understand the difficult issues.)

[divan]

> Native UI frameworks don't bother fixing the real hard problems

I'm genuinely curious what do you mean by that.

My beef with web stack was exactly this - typesetting engine from 80s has been never designed for modern UI/UX needs, and it cannot adequately provide those. Whenever I interact with web apps, I experience so many glitches, weird interaction issues (especially if there is a zoom/selection/scrool involved), that I don't even pay attention to them anymore - it's a norm. It's a norm on web to 'just refresh page' (which is equivalent to 'restart native app') - we do it all the time, because absolute majority of web apps is just crap that requires extremely advanced team of web developers to make it a 'baseline' native-like experience level of quality.

[otabdeveloper4]

I mean if we wanted a good UI/UX framework we'd have to start from typesetting, not add it later as an afterthought to our button and text area widgets.

[divan]

> if we wanted a good UI/UX framework we'd have to start from typesetting

I think UI framework begins with a model of how composition, layout, rendering, input/focus and state works. Typesetting subsystem should be built on top of that.

And that's exactly the problem with this kind of post-rationalization of HTML legacy - it's a wonderful mechanism for what it was created for, but decades of attempts to add and repurpose all those missing foundational blocks for app development leads to the twenty layers of hacks on top of hacks.

[Skwid]

Well now I want an interactive LaTex UI framework in the style of NeWS