[goosejuice]

> I feel like good grades and a good university are still indicators of someone being or is capable of becoming a good programmer.

Really depends on the program. In my undergrad program there were some very smart CS students who got great grades that really struggled with the programming. Smart and capable people can be bad at programming and lack many qualities that make for a good hire.

[kailpa1]

Sure, but isn't this kind of person the exception? I feel like most of the time good grades mean good programming skills