[samat]

Real politics is 1% versus everyone. Mortgage crisis, financial bailout, inflation, taxing of labor and not the assets and assets capture by tiny percent of the population — see what MSM is pushing. This left vs right divide might been useful decades ago, but today is absolutely divide and control tactics

[thrance]

Yeah, you're just describing class warfare. That's a left-wing idea.

[zmgsabst]

It is not.

However, like many social issues, leftists lie about rightwing beliefs, appropriate goodness to themselves, and imply political rivals support The Enemy (TM) and/or Great Evil (TM).

They lie about others in that manner to accrue political power and justify their systemic abuses — eg, using “inclusion” and “diversity” as cudgels and buzzwords to justify re-building systemic racism.

[boxed]

The real politics is between truth and delusion.

[ZeroGravitas]

Right wing originally meant the people defending the divine right of Louis XVI and defending the ultra-rich has been a throughline ever since.

[spwa4]

That's about as relevant to today as what the left orginally stood for (and what the right originally opposed):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reign_of_Terror

Times change. Thankfully.

[ZeroGravitas]

> Enlightenment thought emphasized the importance of rational thinking and began challenging legal and moral foundations of society, providing the leaders of the Reign of Terror with new ideas about the role and structure of government.[7] Jean-Jacques Rousseau's Social Contract argues that each person was born with rights, and they would come together in forming a government that would then protect those rights. Under the social contract, the government was required to act for the general will, which represented the interests of everyone rather than a few factions.

...

> Louis XVI was later able to find support in Leopold II of Austria (brother of Marie Antoinette) and Frederick William II of Prussia. On 27 August 1791, these foreign leaders made the Pillnitz Declaration, saying they would restore the French monarch if other European rulers joined. In response to what they viewed to be the meddling of foreign powers, France declared war on 20 April 1792.

So rich people forming cross national alliances to crush democracy? Have things really changed?

[ecshafer]

Pointing out what left and right mean in France in 1790 is useless. Its like pointing out the Republican party was established to oppose Slavery and Democrats were pro slavery. Or that Democrats were primarily land owners and agriculture in the late 1800s vs business owner republicans, or that 1930-1990 it was democrats for union and workers while republicans were capital and college educated. Things change drastically over time.

[spwa4]

It is very much 2 competing ideologies, yes. But you're being very unfair. You're describing one aspect of what the left stood for (and only what matches with the modern democrats, because these leftists wanted extreme laissez-faire, to the point of giving direct government power to the rich. Why? Because the king's many monopolies and taxes gave jobs to tons of people, but sucked. Somehow that's missing from your description). AND you're totally disregarding what the leftists did.

And on the right you're describing what they did, totally disregarding what they stand for.

Both sides stood against democracy.

That left stood for having "rational thinkers" (ie. capitalists, rich traders, bankers) control government. People who achieved things in society.

The right stood for the same structure as had been there before: nobility and clergy guide society as a whole. The right, even at this point in time, was only rich in power, aside from the king and perhaps in land. Not in money and not in numbers of people under their direct control. In the cities, the king had only limited control and there were far more poeple in cities, even then.

Both sides then went on to massacre each other for about a decade. All over France, spreading even to Egypt (that was the left by the way). Kidnapping tons of Belgians and Dutch citizens and shipping them to South America (that was the left too). Neither side comes out looking very good. But if you compare how many they killed, I'm sorry but the left is the absolute unchallenged champion.

The left you're defending were (pretty extreme) capitalists who were fighting for money-should-control-the-government-directly against people who fought for having moral principles control the government. And yes, you'd be right in pointing out those were very self-serving moral principles. This fight then turned into a decade of massacres. Why are you defending them? Because 4 letters and one direction match your current favorite political party that has very little to do with either side.