[ffsm8]

> Past that I don't see a way for C suite to wake up.

Didn't you mean to temporarily realign? I mean give it 2 years and another manager to show up, ready to get their bonus for the next attempt at it.

That's our reality and how we've structured our markets

[47282847]

I honestly don’t get why anyone would give up their mental health like that and work for such places. In my reality there are plenty of honest and decent places to work at. I’m seen dark places yes but only as visitor - why would I want to be in hell for more than a day or two.

[t43562]

There's the thought that all places are potentially s** in one way or another. This isn't entirely true but there's a significant possibility that any move could be just as bad or worse.

You look at your monthly outgoings and think about how long you have to look before your cash runs out.

I stuck it out too long several times. The most recent one left me unemployed for quite a long time and I was lucky to be in a position for it not to matter.

Now I'm in a job that's a step down - in a sense it's humiliating. On the other hand it more than pays the bills, it's low stress, I've lost 13 kg and I don't wake up in the middle of the night and instantly start thinking of the terrible things that happened in the week so that I can't sleep again.

Now I spend my spare time working in the garden instead of desperately trying to build the new feature on time. I'm digging a driveway. Perhaps this won't last but I realise how much I was killing myself by trying to stay in something bad.

Places are bad essentially because of bad people - it only takes a couple of idiots and it's impossible to fully judge that from an interview. You always get bad vibes from someone or other but you're trying to convince yourself it's ok because you need a job.

[somenameforme]

I don't see why that'd be humiliating by any sense of the word. We don't live long, and there's pretty much nobody who at the end of their life bemoans 'I sure regret not having spent even more time at the office.' More humiliating, at least from my perspective, is the person who works their life away, trying to find contentment from the accumulating of things which, of course, never succeeds. It's like society is full of people playing out what used to be the comical trope of a man in a mid-life crisis, and his new yellow convertible.

[dalvasorsali]

I agree with you, but I feel like leaving is much harder in reality for most people.

Life gets in the way, you don't have the energy to apply, you're afraid of rejection, you are afraid you might end up in a worse environment, you justify it to yourself in any number of ways.

Inertia, herd mentality and self-deception are much more powerful IRL than most people online seem to think (or at least write).

[calgoo]

Add having a family to the mix and it gets worse. Being a sole provider for a family is scary when you go job hunting, especially if you live in an environment that is very expensive (where the jobs that pay decent are located normally).

[npodbielski]

Yep, I left one project because I think I was underpaid there. I could not find another job for like 3 months. I finally found one and I was also very stressful. No it is better, at the same project and I think I make more money than I would ever be able in a project I left. But on the other hand it was very stressful for my family. Was it worth it in the end? I do not know because even if money is better and company is bigger I could damage my kids development by being angry, sad and depressed for two years.

[pegasus]

> I honestly don’t get why anyone would give up their mental health like that and work for such places.

Mostly for money, of course. And all the attendant improvements that can bring to one's life. Some people need it more than others, e.g. a H1B worker who is attempting to pull a whole family out of poverty.

I bet many go in thinking they will do it temporarily, until they pay their college debt, to give one example. But money is very addictive.

[joe_mamba]

> In my reality there are plenty of honest and decent places to work at.

Like wich? In my experience all workplaces have something that's gonna be wrong with them, and you just need to compromise if what's wrong with THAT ONE is acceptable to you.

Like for example honest and decent places to work at tend to also come with lower pay, or pigeon-holing career-limiting type of work, discriminatory gatekeeping, or other such compromises. There's no free lunch where you can have your cake and eat it too, unless you're very lucky.

[alistairSH]

Because companies tend to enshittify over time. Especially if they get acquired. Doubly so if the buying company is PE.

Really small “lifestyle” companies might be fairly immune, but it doesn’t take much for them to fail, there’s a different risk profile.

[LtWorf]

Many times places change because a manager changed and then you have the boiling frog thing where it doesn't become awful all at once.

[falsemyrmidon]

At some point I just work here man, and my job is to do whatever dumb shit management wants me to do this quarter, no matter how dumb it is.

[ozim]

This is what I do believe will happen.

I still have new „business„ guys joining org who try to make „cloud migration”.

We are cloud as a SaaS, we are running on VPS with virtual networks. But they come in and think „to be professional” we should be in „real cloud” like Azure or AWS.

[Sam6late]

I think it is that cycle where old projects will eventually seem less important with huge budgets for new projects by a new manager, that will have bigger allocations, and the bonuses will follow along with the brownie points to that genius.