[foltik]

It’s a bit hard to feel sympathetic here. Those signing this petition actively enable and profit from one of the most pervasive surveillance networks ever built.

Funny how much easier it is to tolerate something when it only affects other people.

[tdb7893]

People uphold a million cruel systems every day, their sort of hypocrisy is so common I've found it just to accept that it's how humans work (especially in a situation like this where their paycheck requires them to not see all the privacy problems they all support). I know I'm hypocritical about a bunch of stuff in my life.

Your perspective might be the more reasonable one but the way I see it, the hypocrisy is frustrating but it's sort of like getting mad at a dog for barking through a fence (dogs gonna dog) so I personally don't find it hard to be sympathetic still.

[compass_copium]

...it's the intrinsic nature of the programmer to have no scruples and work for the shittiest company that can employ them because it offers a big paycheck?

[tdb7893]

I've found that everyone has some hypocrisies that they cling to (it's really hard to see it in yourself). I believe I do a better job of it that Facebook employees, it would be really hard to be more blatantly hypocritical than this, but it's not like I don't make similar errors all the time.

Especially on a post about them doing something decent, I can accept they are obviously hypocritical and just not be concerned with it right now.

Edit: for something like this I think about the advice "don't punish someone for doing what you want them to do". This is Facebook employees publicly signing a pro-privacy document. It's obviously self serving so it would be weird to really praise them as people who protect privacy but I'm happy to support them in this regardless.

[EPWN3D]

Programmers aren't that special once they get a mortgage and a family.

[w4yai]

Basically, yes.

[ElProlactin]

If this is "how humans work", do you feel sympathy for the Nazis who were "just following orders"?

[ianm218]

I find Metas work very unethical but me but I think they should have basic workers rights still. Like yes what Meta is doing is legal and it’s at will work, but this level of surveillance feels like something the law didn’t really anticipate.

[foltik]

I don’t disagree. It’s dehumanizing, and they have a legitimate complaint. In almost any other context I’d be on the side of the workers here. I just have a hard time seeing Meta employees as innocent or helpless bystanders.

[jakelazaroff]

Yeah, this is very much a "leopards ate my face" moment.

[siren2026]

> I think they should have basic workers rights still

You make it look like they are underpaid poor manual workers.

Those are people that chose to make >500k$/year by joining a company that is known to be one of the most toxic tech companies. Mos tof those people had probably multiple offers ad decided to optimize for money besides anything else. I have a hard time to feel sympathy or petition for their "worker's rights"

[xboxnolifes]

The thing about workers' rights, is that they are rights. They don't go away when you get paid more, and they apply to everyone.

[BrenBarn]

But that is also the thing about everyone's rights. No one should be subject to Facebook's surveillance, whether they work for Facebook or not.

[gacgacgac]

Workers are workers. We have so much more in common with one another than we do with the capital class.

Turning against a worker because they are doing better than another worker is giving in the divide and rule.

Historically, this is exactly how factory owners tried to get the white and Black workers to schism rather than unionize.

Workers deserve workers rights, and we should have solidarity towards all workers.

[compass_copium]

I guess man. This kind of doesn't apply to workers who are enabling the bourgeoisie state (cops, programmers making systems to feed data to the NSA, etc.)

[gacgacgac]

I ... actually agree with this. But I think we gotta deliberately select who that applies to. Is it everyone at Meta? Like, are we all culpable for our employers sins? Or are we all squeezed by a system where we gotta work to eat and the people who decide what jobs exist are the capital class?

Like, obviously cops aren't workers, but what level of culpability does a person working in Meta's disability accommodations team have? I dunno. Hard question.

[tibbar]

This feels overly cynical. My long-time friend took a job at Meta (over equally compelling financial alternatives) because the manager pitched the team and growth prospects well. (Meta turned out to be quite disappointing on these fronts. I never heard money as an important factor for joining or for leaving.)

In general, the kind of people who get an offer from any particular big tech company probably can get similar money elsewhere, so it's unlikely to be as big a factor as you suggest.

[avaer]

Presumably the employees didn't ask for this, now they have to choose between accepting this and not having a job.

You could argue they knew the company was horrible when they signed the deal with the devil, but this kind of bait and switch isn't the typical employment relationship; there is room for some sympathy.

[codemog]

We’re supposed to have sympathy for techbros making half a million or more a year because.. they have to have their computer use monitored? Not even getting into the numerous list of unethical behavior of meta..

What a bizarre timeline..

[wahnfrieden]

The workers deserve better conditions without full accountability for leadership's decisions.

If Meta's workers were organized enough to improve their conditions, they could organize to shift company mission and tactics. They are nowhere near organized enough.

[slim]

it's not about symathy. Tactically, would you like your enemy to have this kind of control over its employees ? if the answer is no, you should support them