[vladms]

> We really don't need to import any kind of engineers from outside

I was involved in a startup in the Netherlands. We tried to recruit Dutch people, all wanted safe 9-5 jobs where they would know what they would do in 1-2 years. A startup can not guarantee that.

We ended up with most engineers foreigners, many (but not all) that have studied there.

So I would say that it is also risk and opportunity related. Someone "from outside" will be willing to do more, will have to prove himself, will take more risk. A "local" will have family support, wealth, a network, might want and value stability.

I don't have an opinion about how things "should be", I am just sharing how I saw them (myself an immigrant, multiple times)

[true_religion]

I guess the question for society is: do we want businesses who cannot pay domestic workers a fair wage to exist in our country? Or do we want them to exist elsewhere and we import those products?

To society a startup with a 99%% chance of failing to IPO is no different from a sweatshop which also wants skilled but cheap labor.

[brainwad]

The problem with the latter is then you have no control over how the clothes/software are made. This is the problem the EU is now encountering - all the best software is made by US companies, but it's now tainted by sovereign risk.

[jnwatson]

The solution is obviously the American one. Make everyone so afraid of their job prospects that working for a startup isn't materially different in terms of job security.