[win311fwg]

> Managing an employee is not like electing a representative. We're not describing a boss-employee relationship here.

Quite literally we are. I know it may not feel like it if you are accustomed to sitting back and letting the world crumble around you, but you are electing someone to work for you. What would the voting process be for if you didn't need anyone to do your bidding? Most importantly, why are you putting the elected on the payroll if you don't need them to work for you? Were you under the impression that they work for free?

> I think we have enough evidence at this point to know that this is just not going to do it.

If you don't like being called the boss, there's another word we use to describe participating in democracy: Lobbying. I think we can reasonably conclude that it does work because those who push a dictatorial agenda always cry about how the lobbyists (i.e. those who take time to talk to the workers) actually get things done — just not the things they imagine would get done if there was one all knowing, all powerful supreme dictator. Plus we know it works because we can see it in every other walk of life. The people don't become space aliens when the word government is thrown into the mix. People are people are people.

I get this desire for magic, but magic doesn't exist.

[thunky]

> there's another word we use to describe participating in democracy: Lobbying

And there's another word we can use to describe Lobbying: Bribery.

Lobbying is a (corrupt) industry and I'm not a participant in it, so unfortunately I'm still down to "call your representative".

The system really doesn't work as you say. Representatives don't respond to what their constituents want. They respond to money and and power. That's not democracy.

[win311fwg]

> I'm still down to "call your representative".

Which is literally lobbying, which you refuse to participate in, so that leaves accepting that all your great thoughts will be forever stuck in your head. The person you hired to work with your thoughts is most definitely not a mind reader.

> They respond to money and and power.

Money and power is not some fundamental property of the universe. It is only social. It is given to whom the people want to give it to. So, if the money and power isn't directed where you want to see it, give money and power to someone else.

> That's not democracy.

Right. Democracy takes place when you make yourself heard, by actually talking to people, not computers, about what you feel needs to be heard, while holding the representatives accountable if they do not do their job. So far you appear to be doing neither. If democracy isn't your thing, that's fine. The neat thing about democracy is if you don't like it and choose not to participate, it naturally turns into the only alternative, so everyone wins — except those who cling to the idea of magic. Unfortunately, magic doesn't exist.

[thunky]

> Which is literally lobbying, which you refuse to participate in, so that leaves accepting that all your great thoughts will be forever stuck in your head

It's literally not possible to fix a corrupt system by asking a participant in it to change the system that benefits them.

> Unfortunately, magic doesn't exist.

You are under the illusion that we operate under a functional democracy that responds to the will of the people. It's you that believes in magic, not me.

[win311fwg]

> You are under the illusion that we operate under a functional democracy that responds to the will of the people

If that were the case we wouldn't have spent time talking about how it is broken, nor would we have spent time talking about what needs to be done to fix it. However, like you said, when you benefit from the system there is no incentive to change.

To those reading this who are not winners under the status quo, know that you can change. The power is in your hands. Don't let the propagandists try to convince you that it is hopeless. As they suggest themselves, only those who want to keep things the same seek preservation.

[thunky]

> If that were the case we wouldn't have spent time talking about how it is broken

You've done exactly the opposite. All you've done is defend the system and cast blame at the "bosses" for not doing their job.

> The power is in your hands.

There you go again.

Please update this thread when you put your money where your mouth is and make a real difference. Then all those reading this can be inspired by your actions rather than your empty words.