[jkrejcha]

I kinda disagree, though I do see the usefulness here. While fork/exec can be useful in some cases, it'd be honestly pretty neat if the APIs took a pidfd argument (maybe with 0 meaning current process). Only program is setuid/setgid binaries I suppose but maybe this case is better handled by special casing `exec`.

For example

   pidfd_t ps = spawn(); // creates a process stopped (kernel does this anyway by default)
   setuid(ps, 33);
   capset(ps, ...);
   socket(ps, ...);
   mmap(ps, ...);
   process_vm_writev(ps, ...);
   exec(ps, ...);
   signal(ps, SIGCONT);
   // error handling elided

I guess this is a little bit me being a bit of critical of the usual syscall APIs for not thinking about "what if I want to do this to another process I have access to" but...

It also makes things like thread safety even reasonably doable with fork. I do agree though that stuff like CreateProcess which take in a gazillion parameters don't really make for the greatest of userspace APIs

[uecker]

Maybe, a few people proposed this. It is a lot better than a single spawn call.

But how often would one actually need this? And what are the semantics? Refer arguments (e.g. file descriptors) to the current process or the other one? How are cross-permissions handled? It seems a lot of complexity...

Someones proposed a ptrace_syscall which could achieve the same thing.

[jkrejcha]

> But how often would one actually need this?

Well, the idea is that it'd probably be close to the default API for spawning processes (and could even be the bedrock for posix_spawn and friends in libc (and potentially even "simple" fork cases[1])). fork/clone would be the special case

In most cases, most programs don't need special setup. Something like `ptrace_syscall` would also work for this and would be probably the way to do it with the backwards compat limitations of nowadays

ptrace-ability seems to be generally how permissions for this sort of thing are handled in general (see also procfs, process_vm_writev, ptrace, etc). The complication is a little bit around setuid programs but either you could special case execve to imply SIGCONT for setuid or have execve also imply a SIGCONT as well

[1]: Probably would be rare for a compiler to optimize it though