[lostlogin]

Is even dumber than that.

Funds for Israel flow. Trump was yelling expletives down the phone at Netanyahu this week. Trump has been leading an Israeli war.

It’s dizzying, and it’s almost as though there is a lack of sound minds involved.

Has the US ever been easier to manipulate or spy on?

[pandaman]

>Has the US ever been easier to manipulate or spy on?

Yes, at least nowadays Israel does not try to sink American warships, killing dozens of sailors in the process and then having the US government to cover it up.

[FunnyUsername]

It's pretty absurd to think that Israel would intentionally attack a neutral superpower in the middle of a war for its survival, knowing that at best it would have to apologize and pay reparations, and at worst it would be destroyed by a vastly stronger military.

Friendly fire happens all the time; not everything needs to be a conspiracy.

[pandaman]

Can you give an example of a friendly fire on a warship consisting of continuous air and naval attack over the course of two hours? Just one? Friendly fire will suffice, I am not even asking about some other country doing the same to the US.

As for Israel motivation it's pretty obvious why they did it - they wanted to blame the attack on Egypt and involve the US in the war. Though it does not really matter, even you are unable to deny that Israel attacked the US ship, it's an empirical fact.

[FunnyUsername]

Screwups happen, and it wasn't only on Israel's side. USS Liberty was way closer to the coast/warzone than it should have been due to missing an order, and once attacked, wasn't able to even communicate with its fleet for quite a while, let alone with Israel.

> they wanted to blame the attack on Egypt

There was no attempt to blame Egypt, and the idea is completely implausible - a US investigation could very easily distinguish an Israeli vs an Egyptian attack when a variety of boats (coming from Israeli ports) and many other assets are involved.

[pandaman]

So I figure you could not find an example of friendly fire like that despite your assertion they happen all the time? Color me unsurprised.

>There was no attempt to blame Egypt

Are you an LLM? Of course there was not - the ship survived and there were too many witnesses of Israel doing this, it would be the uber chutzpa to still try to say it was Egypt.

[FunnyUsername]

Your demand for a highly specific friendly-fire incident seems a bit silly. Can you cite an example of the opposite - a tiny country intentionally attacking a ship of a superpower, then pretending it was accidental, giving a apology and millions of dollars of reparations?

And of course I'll demand the same arbitrary specificity - it needs to be a two-hour-long multi-domain assault. Also it needs to be a VC2-S-AP3 type ship whose name ends with "Liberty". If you don't have such examples, I suppose we can stop entertaining your conspiracy theory?

> there were too many witnesses of Israel doing this

Even if there were no eventual survivors, there would still be people throughout the fleet talking on the radio. They would have noticed and communicated about the movements of large ships from Israeli ports, among other very obvious signs of an Israeli operation. There would have been absolutely zero chance of the US not knowing who was behind it.

[lazystar]

or more likely, like we the public do not have the full context of whats going on behind the scenes.

[infinitezest]

Based on what we _do_ know, I have serious doubts that this admin could keep a secret if they wanted to.

[WaxProlix]

Yeah, I have to imagine Donald Trump has better intel and is making wise, measured, well-informed decisions beyond the abilities of your average HNer.

[lostlogin]

If we assume everything you say here is true, why is the US in such a bind with reopening the straits? The risk of Iran behaving exactly like this has been understood for decades. The attack was not a a wise, measured move.

[WaxProlix]

This was (I thought) very obvious sarcasm, the man is an easily manipulated buffoon.

[lostlogin]

I did initially, then decided it wasn't.

I'll go recalibrate my detector!

[cactusplant7374]

Where is the proof that Iran was going to attack the US? I mean real proof and not just saber rattling.

[pvaldes]

> Trump was yelling expletives

We can assume that the conversation didn't went the way that Trump wants us to think.

When somebody annoys Trump, even slightly, he assures to appear on video broadcasted to the whole planet calling infantile expletives to that "ugly" and "incompetent" person. It does not matter if he called "beautiful" and "expert" that same person on the previous hour. As a good narcissist, he will force himself in the middle of the picture every-single-time (and push off the road anybody that would dare to speak for him). Trump is 120% predictable in that sense. Is known to have one of the thinnest skins in the planet and to be easily triggered.

But with Netanyahu curiously we enter in a totally different game, a plausible deniability game of: he-said-that-she-said-that-somebody-has-seen-trump-yelling-on-phone.

Trump must be approved the message but is afraid to emit it personally. Otherwise we should accept the nonsense that such freak of control, the most videotaped man in the planet, became so out-of character that is now allowing leaks, forgiving the whistleblowers, and hiding a video that he personally would absolutely love, LOVE, to show to his fans. A video of him showing dominion assertion over Bibi. The only logical explanation for this save facing move, is that this dominion does not exist and that Israel do what they want.

[pvaldes]

s/must be approved/must have approved/