[Otek]

> What I wanted was to say “hey Siri, call Claw Phone” and have the audio system in my Toyota become an IDE. So I build it.

Or just focus on driving? Why we are doing it to ourselves? It seems so toxic to fill every possible little moment with… productivity? Is it even productive?

This comment is too emotional but i just felt so sad while reading this

[godelski]

I wonder if these people just need to talk.

I wonder if these people are just avoiding thinking about the tough things in their lives.

I wonder if these people are just scared of being human, so reaching for any distraction they can get.

I've tried to stop taking my phone with me when I go to the bathroom. When I shower. When I go to bed. Because I think we all have these same addictions. There's things that suck in life. But maybe if we put our phones down we can work together to solve these things.

- Written on godelski's iPhone while pooping

[doright]

The author says he has two kids, which would likely constrain what he is able to accomplish in his free time.

Children are financially dependent on the parents to provide for them. There's not really much way around that. It makes sense that if you can do more things within the time that is left that people will try to figure out how to cram those things in. What we would have resigned to give up in the past now seems possible to attain with enough AI credits and tools.

[pavel_lishin]

I do know a lot of people who love to talk. I don't think it's a character flaw. It's certainly not what I want, and I would die if I had to talk all day, but it's just the way they prefer to communicate. Same way that some people are introverts and some are extroverts, some people like reading paper books and some people like audiobooks.

[supern0va]

I like how in spite of the author explaining why (father of two small children that occupy his free time), you jumped to the most negative set of possibilities. Instead, it sounds like when he's with his children, he is focusing on them instead of on productivity, which is the opposite of what you're suggesting.

Also, if he instead chose to occupy his drive time with listening to a comedy podcast, or NPR, or even a technical podcast, I can't help but imagine you wouldn't give it a second thought, in spite of that being just as "productive" and "avoiding thinking about the tough things".

[andai]

Excrementalist Philosophy

[analogpixel]

on your drive you could:

a) listen to a useless podcast of two people blathering on about nothing.

b) come up with an idea, and have a coding agent start implementing it; maybe go back and forth on how to improve it.

seems like b is a better use of time.

or c) just stare into the void and let your thoughts consume you; this is my favorite, I don't like listening to stuff when I drive.

[thewebguyd]

or d) just drive.

Surprisingly difficult to do. The assumption is that there are some things we do in our life that act as a blank space that must be filled with something. Productivity, or deep thought, or whatever. People go through life always doing something so there's never a "wasted" moment, but I'd argue thats a recipe for burnout and unhappiness.

There's a buddhist concept of suchness, seeing things exactly as they are in the present without judging them or trying to change them. Doing anything else but "just driving" is trying to live somewhere other than where you actually are. Where ever you are, and whatever you are doing right now is what life is, your life isn't somewhere else in the future, and you don't need to escape from a mundane task and rush somewhere else to experience life. All of it is life, even the boring parts.

[jetbalsa]

I have not very well treated AuADHD and being alone with my thoughts very long is generally not very productive, At least Coding LLMs have helped me get things I wouldn't of had the attention span to make in the past come to life. and a good bit of vibe coding is just yelling at the LLM that what its doing sounds good on paper so keep going, please do the needful, make no mistakes :V

[lucumo]

> I wonder if these people just need to talk.

No. I need to create. That energizes me, and I have far too little time for it.

[cj]

I was a workaholic from 18-26. 12+ hour days for months/years on end. It absolutely was not healthy. Toxic is not an inaccurate label.

But I don't regret it. Those years are the foundation of the career I have in my 30's.

Back in those days, when I wasn't at a computer, I was listening to non-fiction audiobooks on business and software. I don't know how I had such motivation bvack then, but I'm glad I capitalized on it while I had it.

In other words, to people reading questioning if they're working too much: it's okay to work hard as long as you're doing it for the right reasons. (I'll purposely leave "right reasons" undefined, that's on you to evaluate)

I'm just generally not a fan of people putting other people down for wanting to be productive. It's okay to work hard, and it's okay if your identity is your work at least for a short time in your life.

[bluefirebrand]

> I was a workaholic from 18-26. 12+ hour days for months/years on end. It absolutely was not healthy. Toxic is not an inaccurate label. But I don't regret it. Those years are the foundation of the career I have in my 30's.

I'm glad this worked out for you

As a small counter anecdote I guess, I was this person in my 20s too. I arranged my whole life around work, constantly trying to get that next rung. Then I burned out, quit my job, moved to a new city and was unemployed for a year. My career has been pretty decent since then, but it almost had nothing to do with the hard work in my 20s. It's just that where I was working before didn't reward the hard work and where I am now rewards the work I do even though I don't work nearly as hard as I used to

Anyways. All I'm really saying is if you're going to work yourself to the bone trying to get ahead, make sure to take a breath once in a while and look around. Check in with yourself to ensure that the hard work is actually paying off, building the life you want. Otherwise it's just trading your youth and getting nothing in return

[apsurd]

There is a subtle "misery loves company" at play even in one's own trusted circles. Criticizing someone for working too much tip-toes into that realm. It can be well intentioned: everything in moderation, life is about more than work.

But also it can be alienating and dismissive. I have the habit of working every single day. Weekends, holidays, on vacation. Over the years more than one roommate and family member would eventually call me on it. I felt judged. I took it harder than they intended.

I think to them it was a sacrifice. My work ethic was a cost. I could have been out with friends, on the beach takin in the sun. But instead I felt it necessary to toil away toward some Capitalistic superficial goal.

But it's not a toiling cost to me. It's a healthy habit in the way that a morning workout is a healthy habit. It's lucky that enjoying one's work can also "pay off" in the traditional sense. I think that's the key: only you know why you're working. If it's toil toward some Capitalistic superficial goal, just make sure you're aware of your tradeoff.

If it's your morning coffee, I see you buddy! Enjoy your day.

[j45]

I learned a lot during those years too, and in some ways had to learn those things no matter what role or opportunity I chose.

I received some advice to simply add 15 minute of additional "work" a week, and not any more until I could handle it to my baseline... and then be sure to add 15 minutes of "balance" a week as well. Where my work days would go long, I found I was able to tie in habits to go for a walk, eat, etc. This did let me stretch quite far for a longer time, and burn out was a much lower risk.

How efficiently or effectively I learned those lessons could be debatable, but putting in sheer hours on learning and learning to apply things has compounded in some areas very strongly.

At the same time it must be acknowledged that doing this in a way that is not balanced can naturally lead to under development in other areas and it's worth trying to stay mindful of.

Hard work isn't a bad thing, it's the gap of not learning, not improving, not reflecting. There's no shortcut to putting in the work or learning the learnings.

[gedy]

> In other words, to people reading questioning if they're working too much: it's okay to work hard as long as you're doing it for the right reasons.

I personally feel that working reasonable hours even when junior is just as productive for learning, etc. The only thing I learned from being a workaholic is, to not be a workaholic.

[don-code]

I find driving to be one of the most useless ways of spending my time, and if it's for more than half an hour, I do try to figure out some way to increase the value of that time.

I have a weekly commitment that leaves me driving home (~40min) at 9pm, and I usually eat dinner (just a sandwich) while I drive. That also has the advantage of making it so that I'm not eating an hour before bed.

If I know that I need to call someone, I'll usually try to schedule that call while I'm driving. I used to take meetings while driving as well, though I stopped because it was perceived poorly by others.

What's sort of sad is that I can take public transit to all of my regular commitments, and that lets me keep doing something (reading, working, whatever). The schedules are poor, though, and they blow my commute times completely out of the water. For example, I've got a 5-7pm commitment that is a 15-minute drive one way, but if I wanted to go by bus, I'd have to leave at 3:30pm (latest it comes before I need to be there), and get back on it at 8pm (the earliest it comes after I'm done).

[louthy]

> take meetings while driving as well, though I stopped because it was perceived poorly by others.

The lack of self awareness here is astounding. You’re in control of a two ton bullet, please concentrate on the road. Killing somebody because you’re not paying full attention is not a good look.

[don-code]

I agree with you in regard to paying attention while driving, but the perception issue was actually around "you can't be bothered to be at your desk for meetings, so we perceive you as lazy", not "you're a risk to those around you, so we perceive you as irresponsible".

[fragmede]

Why are you jumping to the worst possible interpretation? Who would you kill? America is full of long stretches of double digit hour drives through cornfields where you're not going to run into anything. At worse you'd hurt yourself. Obviously if you're in a city and there are people, even kids around, and you're not giving driving the attention it needs, you're an asshole. Fuck you. But how about not jumping to the conclusion that OP is an asshole?

[louthy]

> Why are you jumping to the worst possible interpretation? Who would you kill?

The person you didn’t see because you weren’t paying attention to the road. Regardless of how busy or not it is.

[appplication]

It’s not useless though. It allows you to engage your default mode network, which is otherwise insanely suppressed in the barrage of constant stimulation that is modern life.

[catgary]

I think you should just focus on the road because most of us are just trying to get home safely to our families. Some of us are even biking beside the road on a lightly-protected bike lane.

[andybak]

Aw jeez. Just take it in the spirit it was intended and stop trying to score "more spiritual than thou" points. We are all deep one day and shallow the next. We are all workaholics and also smelling the roses. You know nothing about the author - you're hijacking a thread to grandstand.

[corndoge]

I agree with this sentiment. So much of human discourse sort of assumes that people are consistent day to day, even hour to hour. It just ain't so!

[knollimar]

Driving is a good time to decompress or hammock based engineer imo

[Avicebron]

Being a hammock-deployed engineer is really the career goal.

[infogulch]

In my experience the driving-behavior part of my brain can run virtually autonomously, like how you don't really have to spend 100% of your brain to walk down the street. This means that the words-thinking part of my brain is almost completely free, with the exception of short high-attention spikes for risky maneuvers like onramp merging. This is why listening to music or podcasts is a very popular driving activity. In many places even handsfree phone calls are allowed as long as both hands are available and your vision isn't obstructed.

I would contend that listening to a podcast or being on a handsfree phone call would be on par with the Claw Phone.

[Terr_]

I find there's an asymmetry between listening and speaking. It's fine for someone else to tell me about their week, but I can't reciprocate with the same level of detail.

I suspect when driving demands attention, it's easier to buffer incoming words to handle a second later, or to simply miss portions and recover.

In contrast, a buffer of outgoing words between mind and mouth is harder to manage, and people prefer not to fall silent in awkward socially-unacceptable ways, especially if the other person might not see what diverted you.

[infogulch]

Yes buffering / dropping on buffer overload is the right frame and the right way to do it in practice. I have seen it done properly. Yes it can cause some social friction but as long as your conversation partner is aware that because you are driving you may buffer/drop conversation packets and they accept that they might have to occasionally exercise patience or repeat themselves then it's fine.

[robinsonb5]

> In my experience the driving-behavior part of my brain can run virtually autonomously

It can, but I've heard quite plausible claims in the past [1] that you shouldn't let it - because that's one of the things that kills motorcyclists. Your autopilot brain is looking out for other cars quite effectively - but a motorcycle isn't a car, and can slip through un-noticed if you're mind is engaged elsewhere.

[1] Citation needed, but lacking I'm afraid!

[Rumudiez]

Daydreaming or zoning out while driving is reckless behavior. You should be fully occupied by the task at hand. If you aren't, find a parking lot to doze off in instead please, or call an Uber

[tamimio]

It’s a mix of virtue signaling and the inability to have own thoughts for few minutes without having existential crisis, no wonder mental illness is off the charts. There’s actually nothing more therapeutic than a night drive on a long road with your own thoughts to process certain events that happened throughout the day/week.

[satvikpendem]

People like different things than you do, not sure why you have to get sad about it.

[Forgeties79]

Always relevant https://youtube.com/watch?v=_o7qjN3KF8U&pp=iggUQAFKEDlhR21Pa...

[derwiki]

My main use case is that I'm driving and think of something I want to remember, and want to record it hands-free without taking my eyes off of the road

[olyjohn]

How important is it really if you can't remember it when you get home?

[j45]

Some folks might be trying to empty what's on their mind.

Very well could be a productivity habit bordering on obsession too.

[micromacrofoot]

Yeah but what if I do this so I have the time in my workday to drive to the beach.

[gobdovan]

I started reading the first part of your comment before opening the article and thought you were mocking AI bros. I then read the rest of your comment and was sure you're misrepresenting TFA. I clicked on the article and started at it in disbelief.

[singpolyma3]

I assumed they meant the 15 minutes waiting in between kind of slots. Not... Actually while driving I hope

[brcmthrowaway]

So a lot of slop out there is just undiagnosed ADHD.