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by xg15 17 days ago
Isn't this a bit of an incorrect usage of the term "backpressure"?

OP quoted the correct definition right at the start:

> In systems engineering, backpressure is the mechanism by which a downstream component signals upstream that it can't accept more work

(the "downstream component" being the human reviewer in this case)

But the measures they propose don't actually do that. They are more like fixed throttle elements which would slow down the rate of submissions of an agent and weed out some low-quality submissions before hitting "downstream".

I'm missing the connection to the actual capacity (or will) that the human developers have to review the submissions.

3 comments

It is incorrect, and that annoys me probably more than it should. Lean people have talked about this for a long time:

- single-piece flow means not making large batches of things and then sending them all downstream at once, but instead working on one thing at a time so downstream has a chance to reject before too much of the wrong thing is produced.

- autonomation (or jidoka) means giving the machine the ability to detect when something is wrong and not continue at that point.

- poka-yoke is a process that forces results to be conformant by construction.

Any and all of these terms would be better than backpressure in this context.

(This made me realise that lean people have been spending decades dealing with the problems we encounter with the new robots that write code. Half of the lean philosophy is about setting up processes and structures that have positive optionality on people's creativity, without undue requirement on their level of responsibility. That's exactly what we want for robots that write code too. We want to capture the benefits of what they do well, without suffering from their innumerable mistakes. But we can't just chastise them for making mistakes, so we have to think the way lean people do.)

Author here. Well noted. I do think backpressure might not be the ideal analogy/term.

It comes from previous posts I’ve come across, but I haven’t considered exactly what you mentioned. That’s on me.

Maybe it's more like shift-left testing [1]? You're trying to move some checks to earlier in the process, if I understood you correctly, and get cheaper feedback loops.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shift-left_testing

Test Driven Development. There's more than several /tdd skills that are popular.
lol your comment sounds like a Claude apology
I had a colleague called Claude. Half of the company was blaming everything on him...
Insincere apologies ought to be mocked to shit but this apology seemed well-meant. (I know you're not mocking them and the last sentence is actually something Claude would say.)

I post this angry comment because LLMs are colonizing the language we use for creating an earnest and genuine tone in online discussion and I sometimes wonder if the suspicion surrounding LLM-ish language is worse for the health of our online spaces than the LLM slop itself. Thinking about it, I don't think it is; and it would be impossible to measure anyway.

Honestly? The point lands.
It is an incorrect use of what was already a flawed metaphor. Pressure is isotropic. Directed pressure makes no sense, like all other fluid analogies in unrelated fields of engineering.
Wait so cross ventilation, where a breeze will flow through a house if windows are open on opposite sides at a much greater rate than if windows are only open on the upwind side… isn’t really a thing?
Air moves from regions of high pressure to regions of low pressure. Pressure itself does not have a direction.
I took the analogy to be about the location of the pressure and not the direction. If you allow pressure to build on the input pipe when you can't accept more, the component that is upstream in the flow is able to observe that and respond. Maybe the difference is I envisioned a series of pipes and not a single one.
The act of "making pressure" means applying a force and is completely directional.
so this is about lower or upper back pressure?