[ifwinterco]

How does Tesla fit with the rest of those?

I'm not a huge fan of Elon Musk but Tesla is a company that produces electric cars (mostly in western countries with half-decent labour laws), it's not associated with any of those things.

I guess one could argue with some merit that the governance is bad enough to exclude it on that basis alone?

[sgt]

Agreed - Tesla has been an insanely good investment. I'm not sure about the next 10 years, but people have continuously underestimated them (and Elon Musk). The Norwegian so called Oil Fund owns more than 1% of Tesla.

[Gomotono]

Tesla is not and never has been a good investment.

Its a gamble.

The current evaluation of Tesla is still higher than real car companies + robot companies + robot taxi companies.

[derektank]

Never is a strong statement. Tesla’s price to sales ratio wasn’t absurd prior to 2020.

[Gomotono]

If you want to make sure to be very very specific, yeah for sure Tesla had a timeframe were the ratio was not bonkers.

[sgt]

Fair enough I guess, it has been a gamble. But risky investments are still investments that paid off well. Or they can drop like a rock.

[RugnirViking]

has it been an insanely good investment because of changes to profit and loss, or because of other factors? (of course, building a car company of the scale they have is impressive. But by looking at tesla's financials vs stock price, youd conclude basically any other car company ever was a great buy by any reasonable metric)

[Luc]

"Danish pension company Akademikir Pension has announced it will divest from Tesla due to ongoing concerns about labour rights, corporate governance, and Tesla CEO and co-founder, Elon Musk's behaviour."

https://www.europeanpensions.net/ep/Denmarks-Akademiker-Pens...

[acdha]

Tesla has a P/E wildly out of line with the rest of their sector and is facing strong competition with a largely absentee CEO who has a history of making very bad decisions over the objections of more skilled staff (politics, of course, but also things like how the Cybertruck is so expensive to make and own). At some point that bubble is going to pop so I can understand a pension fund being more focused on long term returns passing on them.

[Gomotono]

Europe is still a democracy and while its apparently not relevant in the US America, Elon Musk as the richest person on the planet directly tried to involve him in europe elections.

[derektank]

In a liberal society governed by laws, increased scrutiny must follow evidence of wrongdoing, not mere association. If European countries have problems with Musk’s conduct (lord knows I do) they should either pass legislation targeting behavior he has engaged in that is not already illegal, or charge him with a crime/bring a civil suit against him if he has violated existing law.

To be clear, this has already happened to some degree. See Paris prosecutors investigating him for the distribution of child pornography. But targeting companies he is affiliated with for his personal behavior violates the principle of the generality of law.

[Gomotono]

If a society fights an entity with extrem inbalance like wealth or power, i don't think principle of the generality of law is critical here.

[Matl]

Tesla is known for hazardous factory conditions, worker mistreatment etc.[1]

Then there's the autopilot misleading marketing, Cybertruck being glued together with spit glue and duct tape etc.

1 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Tesla,_Inc.#Worki...