[tobinfricke]

Is it feasible to run Linux on the Apple hardware? Seems like that could meet your requirements, except possibly "align with my values." I saw https://asahilinux.org/ but don't know how usable it is, or whether the long battery life and hardware support is preserved.

[whimblepop]

I love the Asahi project and I'll probably keep my oldest M-series Mac around to continue to play with Asahi. But even for the oldest Macs it supports, the feature list is not quite complete. The way Apple does a lot of things is bespoke and involves a different division of labor between firmware and operating system than conventional UEFI systems. It's hard to support. I don't want to be required to wait years for features like full support for Thunderbolt docks, and I also want to give my money to a company that proactively supports Linux (e.g., sending hardware to kernel developers, FreeDesktop graphics driver developers, DE maintainers, and distro maintainers in advance of the release of new products) rather than always buying used or giving my money to a company that merely tolerates Linux support.

Again, I love the ambition of the Asahi project and what they've done. They're impressive hackers, and thousands of people will doubtless get years of happy Linux life out of their work— maybe including me! I have no complaints for them, and no wishlist I want to bring to them. In fact, I think maybe I should send them a donation or a kind email or both upon their next release.

But I want to give the bulk of my financial support to a computer vendor who offers me first-class, day-1 support for software environments that make me feel happy and respected. The Asahi team can't turn Apple into that by themselves.

[benoau]

Every generation of Mac has its own requirements that Asahi has to support through a painstaking process of reverse-engineering, so it lags behind quite a bit. Realistically it will probably be 2030 before you can use it on any current-generation Mac.

[GeekyBear]

The current leadership team at Asahi decided to prioritize upstreaming their existing work over reverse engineering on newer systems.

Given that you can score a used M1 Air for half the price of a new Macbook Neo (and have Linux be supported), it's an even better value compared to the Framework, for those who prefer Linux.

[2OEH8eoCRo0]

It's irritating to see it constantly recommended as a real option.

[hparadiz]

I think it's a feasible option I just can't use it for work because here's how that goes:

> "Hey can you remove MDM from this Macbook so I can install Linux?"

No.

> "Hey can I get a linux laptop for a hardware refresh?"

Sure.

Asahi on an M2 Macbook Pro supports almost everything https://asahilinux.org/fedora/#device-support

[wat10000]

Almost everything, and that's already three generations behind.

[hparadiz]

I don't really need USB-C displays or Thunderbolt for my use case. The touch ID is easily replaced with a Yubikey.

Everything else just works. What is the problem?

[Rohansi]

Sounds great for you! What about everyone else?

Many people prefer to get new devices so that they can be covered by Apple Care. That completely removes Linux as an option because Asahi Linux never supports any of the recent models.

[wat10000]

"Buy this computer, it's several generations behind and a bunch of stuff doesn't work" is not a ringing endorsement, even if it does work well enough for you.

[GeekyBear]

USB display support was demoed at a conference at the end of last year.

[curt15]

"Hey can you remove MDM from this Macbook so I can install Linux?"

Is there no MDM for Linux clients? How do the big tech companies with Linux developer machines (Google, Facebook, etc) manage their inventory? Do they roll their own MDM?

[michaelt]

IT departments can mandate tools like ninjaone and kolide, which let them run queries across the fleet of devices, and (as I understand it) basically gives them root-level remote code execution.

The corporate VPN (or equivalent) can then perform 'posture checking' requiring that the tools be installed and working before connecting to the corporate network.

Obviously, 99% of Linux users have root on their device so nothing stops them wiping it and installing something new from scratch. But then they'll fail the posture checks until the device is returned to the approved setup.

[hparadiz]

Kolide admin provides a web UI for osquery so you can query things. It allows remote osquery queries but not remote code execution. You generally pair it with CrowdStrike Falcon.

Kolide does a spot check like "is falcon sensor running" but if the user logs in, has the session token created, and then disables whatever the session token would still be valid.

Also Kolide doesn't actually count as an MDM. Has a bunch of missing features. I recently evaluated it.

[pjmlp]

Failing compliance in many jobs isn't a simple "ooops, sorry".

[regexorcist]

It is a real option, in fact the only option for many who can't tolerate macOS, to use these devices.

[kamranjon]

I believe it's what Linus Torvalds uses.

[2OEH8eoCRo0]

Fedora

https://www.reddit.com/r/Fedora/comments/1pb8lgz/linus_torva...

[kamranjon]

My info might be a few years old, but I think he uses it on his laptop machine.

https://lwn.net/Articles/903023/

"On a personal note, the most interesting part here is that I did the release (and am writing this) on an arm64 laptop. It's something I've been waiting for for a _loong_ time, and it's finally reality, thanks to the Asahi team. We've had arm64 hardware around running Linux for a long time, but none of it has really been usable as a development platform until now."

[taude]

i've tried getting linux to run on a 2018 MB Pro (intel/nvidia based). Even after a ton of research and installing a couple "compatible-ish" distros, I couldn't get it to work, and gave up. And then further reading suggested I was always going to live with a semi-bricked machine. I just wanted a simple writing and couch surfing laptop. But the version of MacOs running on that old hardware is so slugish, it's painful.

[regexorcist]

A Fedora live USB should just boot on an Intel MBP (maybe you have to hold Alt? Don't remember). Then you can install it to disk. I was happily running Linux on a 2015 model until recently, still a good machine for most things.

[taude]

I'll give this a try, both sound and wifi will work? (I'll check it out.)

[AlexeyBrin]

You may have more luck with Omarchy - apparently they test against most Intel Mac based models.

[taude]

Interesting, I do have an omarchy install already on a USB. I didn't try that one on the old Macbook pro, though. Thanks for the suggestions.