[piva00]

It lowered the chances, and in case of getting sick it also massively lowered the chances of getting the worst side-effects, exactly like any other vaccine does.

It's a shame that even highly educated populations do not understand a basic fact of immunology.

[protonbob]

Yeah what a shame. I never claimed that it didn't lower the chances of side effects.

This is what was claimed.

"You become a dead end to the virus." — Fauci, 2021

This was the reality

"[Vaccines against respiratory viruses produce] decidedly suboptimal protection." — Fauci, Cell Host & Microbe journal article, 2023

"The durability of protection against infection and hence transmission was relatively limited." — Fauci, 2024 congressional testimony

Anybody that questioned the religious dogma that the vaccines were super effective and that healthy people needed to get endless boosters were crucified and in many cases, fired from their jobs for refusing an unnecessary medical procedure.

[piva00]

I don't live in the USA, so whatever was claimed is not universal.

[protonbob]

Not massively lowering the chances is universal.

[triceratops]

I would've been ok with not forcing healthy people to get vaccinated, if they agreed to not seek treatment in case they got Covid.

[protonbob]

Natural immunity was just as strong as getting vaccinated though despite what you might have been told.

"All of the included studies found at least statistical equivalence between the protection of full vaccination and natural immunity; and three studies found superiority of natural immunity" --Shenai, Rahme & Noorchashm — Cureus / PubMed, October 2021

[triceratops]

Well then you don't need treatment for Covid, right? Stay natural.

[alchemism]

Cull the human herd because Bob is too much of an individual to participate. An ironic solution.

[emj]

There are so many things that went wrong during the pandemic. You were not lied to, that means someone has intent.

The lesson was not that vaccines are bad imho. I do not live in the US, so I just find it tiresome to listen to you guys blaming everything on people. There was no right way.

[protonbob]

Vaccines for respiratory illnesses are bad. Even Fauci admitted so. Why do you assume good intent from the United States government when the FDA is bought and paid for by pharmaceutical companies.There was so much money to be made on specifically covid vaccines. I am not anti vax in general.

[piva00]

The flu vaccine has saved countless elderly lives.

You don't assume good intent from the US and its institutions, fine, but other countries also rolled out vaccines, are they all bought and paid by pharma companies? Is that really the argument?

[protonbob]

Yes exactly. They are great for immunocompromised people. Much less so for healthy people. Which is why it should have been an option and not mandatory.

[piva00]

Herd immunity depends on the most amount of people being vaccinated, it's a numbers game, lowered chances of contracting the disease among the vaccinated translates into dwindling chances for spread.

Just look at measles, to stop spreading it to children who cannot take the vaccine due to other health issues you need almost every children that can be vaccinated to be vaccinated, otherwise the disease spreads.

It's not a really hard concept to grasp. It was crisis time, you don't get to play with lives at that point due to your individualistic convictions.