[Curosinono]

I don't believe. I accept things i don't know and i know what i know.

There is no inherant issue with this. in contrary it makes me mentally stronger.

I can choose on my own terms if/when i want to end my life. If i get very sick, i don't have to hope for a god or priests blessing to end my life, i will just do it.

But religion is different: if you believe that homosexuality is wrong due to your religion, there is nothing i can argue about. Your priest told you this based on some book or story from 2000 years ago and you do not question this.

I know plenty of strong christians and muslism in germany who do not like homosexual people. And its dividing our society.

[lobocinza]

> I don't believe.

You believe that you don't believe.

> But religion is different: if you believe that homosexuality is wrong due to your religion, there is nothing i can argue about. Your priest told you this based on some book or story from 2000 years ago and you do not question this.

This isn't the Church doctrine. The Church doesn't target homosexuals or even homosexuality in particular but ALL sexual practices that deviates from the unitive and procreative aspects of human sexuality. Christians don't believe in this because a book written thousands of years ago say so but because deep in their souls it makes sense and is the truth for them. Homosexuals are welcome on the Church as any other sinner what is ridiculous is to expect the Church to condone sins and bless sinful relationships be them homosexual or heterosexual.

> I know plenty of strong christians and muslism in germany who do not like homosexual people. And its dividing our society.

Perhaps it is something else that divides.

[Curosinono]

No i do not believe. You don't change it just because you say that i believe in not believing.

There is also a clear definition for it:

"Believing is the mental act of accepting something as true, real, or correct, often without requiring absolute, physical proof."

I'm absolutly fine saying that I don't know something. I do not know a god exist, or multiply etc. But honestly that question comes down to me more like "Does randomess exist".

Yes its absoutly a religios thing that homosexuality is bad. You call it yourself 'sinful relationship'. Its not a sin just because church doesn't like it. Also plenty of religions are responsible for making it a sin outside of religion.

And yes if the church condonse all sexual practices, it does include homosexuality and makes it a church doctrine.

[lobocinza]

So you don't believe in black holes or dark matter? Because neither of them, among many other things, have absolute physical proof. How do you even cross a street or go outside if you don't believe and can't have absolute physical proof that you will not be harmed.

[chickensong]

> Christians don't believe in this because a book written thousands of years ago say so but because deep in their souls it makes sense and is the truth for them.

Sorry mate, but that's just cultural indoctrination that made them feel that way, and the culture is intimately tied to the book.

[lobocinza]

Progressive narratives and ideas are much more prevalent in modern society than religious ones. It would be easier to argue that cultural indoctrination makes progressists feel that way.

[chickensong]

Both can be true. We're all susceptible to whatever culture we're indoctrinated to. Progressive narratives are still young though, while established religions have a long history, momentum, and large user base to perpetuate their culture and agenda. In the case of Christianity, it's one of the core goals of the religion.

You can downvote me all you want, but arguing that Christians' beliefs aren't tied to the bible is ridiculous. Their "deep soul" feelings are beliefs, which are formed by cultural indoctrination, and the bible is the cornerstone of the Christian culture.

[lobocinza]

I can't downvote you even if I wanted. Progressive narratives are not young. The current flavor is young but the US Progressive movement is ~130 years and the Christian eschatology with God removed that it is based upon goes back to the Enlightenment era.

For Catholics the Bible is very important but it is a map not the territory. Tradition is equally important and there is also Revelation, in the Creation, in the Universe and in our own human nature.

You're reducing everything to a book and missing two millenia of reflection upon human nature, on our purpose in this world, the thousands of books written, the millions of debates, you're missing out on a corpus of knowledge that is rich and can't be found elsewhere.

We value the map not because it's old and we are indoctrinated to, but because we see territory and roads that don't show up on the modern maps. The old map is hard to read and uncomfortable, but it leads to true places, whereas the modern maps are pretty, colorful, with good UX ("everything is allowed"), but route you to bad places and dead ends.