[embedding-shape]

> but also like the definition of project scope creep.

To me it seems like the opposite, it has more connectivity and I/O than the Zero, but also scaled down, while using better materials, like they decided to outsource the project scope creep to the community, which makes sense to me.

[salomonk_mur]

Man, they put 2 processors in the thing and are building their own OS. They even say they are not sure how to get it accomplished.

Scope creep to hell and back. Could just let the device get turned off like literally any other device on earth, and not have to build a whole new fucking OS to get it running.

They even - for some reason - want to waste time "training their own AI model because general ones don't cut it" (which no one is likey to use). Could just build a normal RAG + context stuffing pipeline in an afternoon but nah, let's devote a few months to this completely unnecessary non-feature.

100 bucks say this doesn't see the light of day before 2030 (if it ever does!)

[lxgr]

> Could just let the device get turned off like literally any other device on earth, and not have to build a whole new fucking OS to get it running.

This is actually quite common in embedded devices and even elsewhere. Every Apple device does this, for example (the Secure Enclave is a completely separate OS running on a separate computer).

If you think about it, most laptops have been doing something like this for decades as well for things like brightness control etc., not with a different CPU but definitely an OS-like thing (i.e. the BIOS, using SMIs etc.)

The idea of the "single OS, single CPU computer" has been a myth for a while now.

[miladyincontrol]

Yeah, CPU + MCU isnt exactly a foreign or strange idea. And they're hardly developing "their own OS", just configuring a default linux distro with various integrations particularly around display, IO and custom applets to interface with existing linux terminal programs and libraries.

[rincebrain]

They do appear to be trying to build something a bit more bespoke than that, where they want something like Fedora Silverblue or what systemd seems to want to present, in terms of contained overlays for snapshotting when you make changes and then going "oh no" without requiring a full reinstall.

God knows if they'll end up scaling back their goals, but the vision isn't "just" a few custom integrations.

[reaperducer]

The idea of the "single OS, single CPU computer" has been a myth for a while now.

At least since they started running Java on SIM cards.

[lxgr]

Good point, and quite on topic given that this thing will have a SIM slot, so we're at at least three OSes and CPUs and counting :)

The Bluetooth and Wi-Fi chipsets usually have their own CPU as well.

[tmountain]

Big dreamers, which is awesome, but they need a disciplined PM type team member to bring them down to Earth (ROI analysis on their roadmap).

[embedding-shape]

> ROI analysis on their roadmap

I think we've developed software with "ROI" in mind for so long, that by now most people forgot how it was to use devices and interfaces that were made with passion and by taking your time, experimenting and finding the right way, rather than just rushing through stuff and optimizing everything for money.

I remember Flipper Zero had a ton of doubters early on too, myself included. I think I'm now willing to give them more slack to actually experiment and create something even more ambitious, as they successfully executed it the first time most doubted them.

[Aurornis]

I've worked in startups long enough to see many founders build without considering ROI.

It's not rare at all.

The reason you don't see those projects is because they don't make it very far. Big projects take a lot of effort and people and most people expect compensation for their effort. You can't compensate them without ROI.

As an open-source project they have some benefit of getting contributors to do some of the work. The hardware still needs ROI to exist. Making those custom parts requires up-front capital, which is going to need ROI to pay back.