[Shalomboy]

I'm legitimately curious how these American payment companies held onto their worldwide dominance for so long. I'm used to seeing the sign at restaurants of all the other cards they accept, but for so long I've only ever seen Amex, Discover, Visa, and Mastercard in folks' hands.

[trashb]

There is a huge first movers advantage on infrastructure.

Additionally until recently most political parties and people in the EU didn't see this as national security related infrastructure. That's why it was allowed to be privatized and handled by external companies. There is a lot more critical digital infrastructure that is being moved away from. Think Microsoft office suite, operating systems, cloud systems and more.

[whizzter]

Bank deals, especially in Europe where debit cards is more popular than credit the issuing banks preferred deals largely dictate what network you'll be on.

[carlosjobim]

It's very easy to understand: Paying by credit or debit card is incredibly easy and convenient for customers, and transactions have been instant for a long time, thanks to great technical infrastructure. While bank transfers still take days in some cases.

Most importantly: These cards give customers fraud protection, which is in many cases essential when making online purchases or when traveling. Which leads to more sales for sellers as well, when that worry is removed from the shoulders of customers.

[karel-3d]

Amex is not very popular in Europe. Discover... I am not sure, not that much.

Visa and MasterCard are everywhere though

[ravenstine]

Based on my recent experience, Discover is spotty in Europe but some places definitely accept it. Not that great if you're on vacation and want to avoid hassle, though. Discover is my main driver (both credit and bank) in the US, but I decided to use a Visa card in Europe just to avoid random rejections. But you won't be screwed in western Europe if all you have is a Discover card.

[lxgr]

Really depends on the country. Discover acceptance is actually relatively good globally, as they have interconnections to Diners Club, JCB and China UnionPay.

[Keyframe]

geopolitics, dollar, and then network effect. in that order.

[lxgr]

What bearing does the dollar have on any of this exactly?

[Keyframe]

What do you mean? How it cannot? In Europe's context, 60's and 70's, was a collection of fractured dozens of small countries each with its own currency. US had a single currency which was also world's reserve currency so every major bank on this planet already had to build technical and legal pipelines to handle global trade. On top of that you had US omnipresence in post WW2 Europe and world for that matter. American payment networks were the fastest and obvious place to build payment networks across all those borders which was then also a footing ground into intra-market payments. As I said - geopolitics, dollar, network effect in that order. Can't have one without the other.

[lxgr]

Banks can settle with Visa and Mastercard in their currency of choice, so I don't see why the dollar matters for any of that.

And regarding Visa and Mastercard being US payment networks: This is now undoubtedly the case, but for much of their history, their EU subsidiaries were actually independent cooperatives owned by large European network member banks. They only sold their respective stakes to the US parent organizations in the late 90s, back when European banks, in a pretty severe blunder, considered cards a thing of the past of no importance for the future.

[deaton]

Its simple: they have deals with all the big banks who issue the popular cards with all of the rewards, so those are the cards people get.

[gordian-mind]

European tech is often atrocious. Every single digital government program in France has been hacked, every social security number is out there, physical addresses tied to crypto wallets, etc.