[Trufa]

How involved is the software in the car, any while driving features? I'd be a little bit afraid of getting in that car even with the best efforts of the community, maybe it's not really for driving, i'd be even more nervous to get in a car with no updates, but still.

[jazzyjackson]

More than anything I am nervous about having a car running priority code that can have mandatory updates pushed at any time that change the cars behavior -- not just throttle response and adjusting the emissions here, they could be updating thresholds for when the auto-pilot cancels and return to manual control, what level of cruise the car defaults to (GM BlueCruise IMO is terrible about this, it cancels hands free mode often, without any auditory alert) and so on.

Give me a car without internet uplink any day!

[dylan604]

That's my issue. You could drive the car one day, go to bed, and the next day the car does not perform the same way it did yesterday. That's ridiculous. Any update needs to be approved by the user. Even if that means doing like Apple does where the user has to enter their password to approve the update scheduled for the middle of the night.

[freakynit]

A few days back, the breaks of my car suddenly stopped working. By stopped-working I mean they just got jammed. No matter how much I press, they just wouldn't budge. The reason: my car had abruptly turned-off by itself, jamming the breaks with it. HOW TF are breaks NOT connected directly to the tyres? Why the tf they have to be software controlled? This is the "critical" path, and SHOULD be 100% under driver's control, at all times.

And then just 3 days back, the same thing happened with steering wheel while I was reversing the car. But this time, the car hadn't even turned-off... the wheel just got jammed. Restarted the card, and it worked. What the absolute fck man!! What tf!

Electronics and the corresponding software should stay 100% out of all critical paths inside of the car. Sure if it "helps", it's fine, but, that should NOT turn into such outcomes.

[foobarbecue]

What model? Is it possible that you accidentally had the car in a power-on mode, but without the engine started? I've done that by accident in my Mitsubishi Outlander Sport. The symptoms are similar to what you describe. Actually, it was at a car wash -- attendant left the car power on and I thought the engine was running so tried to drive away. Got the car to move a bit (happened to be downhill) but it was super scary because the brake pedal was taking more and more force to push down and I could barely turn the steering wheel. Luckily I was smart enough to put it in park, check everything, and realize the engine wasn't running!

The brakes (n.b., spelling) and steering will feel increasingly stiff or "locked up" if your engine is off because the engine is not powering the vacuum system that powers the brake booster, and the steering will be extremely difficult to operate without the assistance of power steering.

[freakynit]

Yep yep yep.. that explains it. Not the software fault as I original suspected (at least in the break-jamming case). What I "felt" like jammed was probably just that vacuum system not helping, but since it happened for the first time (with me), and so abruptly, it felt like the brakes were jammed.

But, the worrying, and a lot more scarier part is that this was not me accidentally leaving the car in accessory/power-on mode. The engine cut out while I was driving, which is itself a serious fault.

Regarding the steering wheel case, it still feels like electronic/software fault since the car was actually reversing on engine power. But, similar to the first case, most likely it was also not jammed, rather, i lost the power steering assist, and hence, it "felt" like jammed since it happened first time to me.

Im from India btw and the car in question is a 10+ year old Maruti Suzuki Swift Dzire.

---

Summary:

1. Break issue: vacuum assist lost due to engine shutting off (by itself) which "felt" like it "jammed" the breaks, but, most probably had just gotten super stiff instead.

2. Steering wheel: Still looks like a software/electronic fault, but, similar to the break case, it "felt" like jammed.. but, it had just gotten super stiff.

This all, however, is still so wrong. In either of the cases the fault was not mine, yet, I was put in a situation that could have been very serious.

[freakynit]

So I researched a bit more on that break thingy... and just learned that this assist provides anywhere form 4x to 10x the assist. And without it, you would literally have to stand on the breaks with full body weight to have a similar effect. Wow!!

[Barbing]

Funfact4life, even with modern cars in emergency braking scenarios you _still_ want to STAND on that brake pedal with all your weight!

...ooh, a mnemonic: "STOMP, STAY and STEER". (Stomp brake, Stay stomped, Steer around obstacles while pressing brake hard.) Even if it vibrates!

[Grand]pa had to "pump" his brakes (on/off/on/off), we have it easier :)

[defrost]

> Steer around obstacles while pressing brake hard

That seems like a good way to flip a car or truck.

Also runs counter to the advice that's given for surviving a sudden kangaroo on road at night incident .. for the past 60+ years.

eg:

  Don’t swerve Most severe crashes involving an animal occur when the driver veers off the road, and hits something else instead. What’s more, the animal is just as likely to flee in the direction you’re steering.

  Brake in a straight line The only thing worse than swerving, is swerving with locked up tyres. Keeping a straight-line trajectory while you hit the brakes will allow you to reduce speed quickly, then – if the animal still hasn’t moved and you’ve reached a safe speed – you can steer around.

~ https://www.isuzu.com.au/news/news-articles/how-to-avoid-a-k...

and

  6. Slow it down, don’t swerve

~ https://www.huddleinsurance.com/post/kangaroos-australian-ro...

[foobarbecue]

One more bit of info you might find helpful: the word is written "brake," not "break." We share a weird language.

[forgetfreeman]

That's ridiculous. What year make and model car do you have?

[freakynit]

It's a 10+ year old Maruti Suzuki Swift Dzire from India. See my reply to previous comment.. it doesn't seem like software fault (at least not fully).

[throwaway173738]

There are a lot of mechanical reasons your engine will die. For example crankshaft or camshaft position sensors failing will do it because the engine control module can’t time fuel injection or spark properly.

[freakynit]

yep.. been reading since the comment a lot ... there are so so so many parts in a car... holy cow!!

[KennyBlanken]

I remember watching a youtube video where the one guy who has become The Fisker Whisperer said that screwing up an update will total the vehicle because several of the control modules just can't be had anywhere, at least until another ends up in a junkyard.

There is literally nothing about any Fisker automobile that makes it worth all this effort. But a handful of rich boomer tech execs think there's nothing else in the world that could possibly meet their expectations for a hybrid or electric vehicle, have more wealth than they know what to do with, and so here we are.

Saabs are much the same way. Some nonsense about a completely overengineered security system in the newer vehicles that makes losing a key a "well, now you're fucked" event, I believe?