[JumpCrisscross]

> If the EU wants to fully shield itself, it should aggressively counter-sanction American entities

This isn’t a realistic option without an independent security posture. Washington could bankrupt Europe overnight right now with targeted tourism, technical and financial sanctions. (And increasingly, energy.) All of that before considering kneecapping Europe’s NATO-integrated kit.

[embedding-shape]

> Washington could bankrupt Europe overnight right now with targeted tourism, technical and financial sanctions.

Yet again the American exceptionalism bleeds through and shows why the hegemony is currently dying. Maybe with a slight bit of humbleness it could have survived but no, the exceptionalism is so well encoded that it seems short of impossible to stop the decline at this point.

Seemingly this was the idea with Iran too, which based on the current goings, isn't going so well. How do you expect that to be true for the second/third largest economy in the world, when the US can't even do so with Iran, one of the already most sanctioned countries in the world?

[JumpCrisscross]

> American exceptionalism bleeds through

None of this requires America be better at anything. It just requires the current finance and trade flows to be what they are.

> Seemingly this was the idea with Iran too

The analogy doesn’t work. American sanctions and adversarialism with Iran have famously granted us few grabholds on their system. Tehran is sovereign.

To the extent there is an analogy here, it’s in European reliance on America being its Hormuz. The obvious vulnerability that gives America asymmetric capability over Europe is the financial, security, energy and trade reliance. Unlike the Hormuz, those aren’t geographic features. But if Brussels is content with mincing around with their own special pile of AMD chips (or tourism bans or whatnot), it might as well be carved into rock.

[mike_hearn]

The Iranian economy is in a state of total collapse! That's not something to aspire to.

It's not good to be in denial about this. Even small amounts of US pressure would create chaos in Europe at this point. Multiple European countries are heading towards a major financial crisis entirely on their own, even without any US involvement at all. See e.g. the UK, whose debt is now much too large for even an IMF bailout to work. Only massive austerity of the type that makes 2008 look like splashing around in warm water will be enough to turn that around.

Europe is not independent. Even ignoring basics like oil and gas, the choices of the EU ruling elites in Brussels have, over a period of many years, broken any ability to create a competitive domestic tech industry (something very difficult even with China-style global cutoffs). Even if it was all fixed tomorrow it's far too late. Building a competitive domestic office suite is far beyond what the EU can achieve, let alone everything else required.

[embedding-shape]

> The Iranian economy is in a state of total collapse! That's not something to aspire to.

Right, I agree, situation is awful and Iran is struggling. But is it bankrupt? Did the US bankrupt much-smaller-than-Europe Iran overnight? Nope, so lets not be under the false belief that somehow Europe would be easier, that's backwards.

[AVocaloidFaN]

Yes, they essentially did, so far as civilians are concerned.

Most people can't afford food anymore. Minimum rent is like 40% over minimum wage (and most make only that much, including government employees). A lot of things cost 2x over what they did before the war.

I'm gonna quote a friend of mine that lives in Iran (though he's slightly better off due to family)'s comment on the matter: "When I go get a full bag of groceries and a kid is caught with a can of tuna under his clothes, crying, how am I supposed to feel good about having money"

[mike_hearn]

The word bankrupt loses precise meaning when applied to countries that can print their own currency, as Iran can. It just means something like "collapse with hyperinflation". Iran is in a state of collapse and experiencing hyperinflation. That's what bankruptcy looks like for a country.