[aspenmartin]

Well said: why does a tax break bother people so much? That feels pretty populist to me: data centers of this magnitude offer a ton of economic benefits to the area and the state, 3.3B in tax breaks are the price to pay to incentivize them to bring the business to the area, which will then provide a net positive financial benefit. I can see plenty of problems with data center construction that should definitely be addressed, but why do you think states offer such huge incentives?

[ceejayoz]

> Well said: why does a tax break bother people so much?

Because it's their money being handed to a trillion dollar company that has no need for a discount?

[newfriend]

A tax break isn't handing anyone money.

[ceejayoz]

Sure it is. It's more money in Facebook's pocket, and less in the local coffers. Either services get cut, or residents pay more.

If the IRS gives me a 10% tax break, I have more money, and the government has less, right?

[newfriend]

But it's not less in local coffers. If the incentive was not given, the datacenter would not be built there. The state government wants it to be built there to increase economic activity in their state.

Residents aren't paying more for anything and no services are being cut.

[ceejayoz]

> But it's not less in local coffers.

The local government is giving a local tax break, which comes out of their local tax revenue.

> If the incentive was not given, the datacenter would not be built there.

Objection, your honor, assuming facts not in evidence!

(Nor are the incentives any sort of guarantee. https://www.cnbc.com/2021/04/21/foxconn-mostly-abandons-10-b...)

> Residents aren't paying more for anything and no services are being cut.

They are receiving less tax revenue than they would have otherwise had to use on their services.

[newfriend]

You are assuming the datacenter would be built there without the incentive. That is highly unlikely.

[ssl-3]

Long-term tax-breaks for something like a factory, which will ideally employ hundreds or thousands of people for a very long time? That can make sense. There's a lasting, local benefit, and that benefit can stand some encouragement. Real, local people will have real, local jobs. It can be good.

Datacenters aren't like that. There's a huge construction phase where billions of dollars get spent followed by dozens of long-term employees. The local benefit is mostly just a flash in a pan while the tax break lasts for decades.

Besides, it seems that datacenters are universally unliked by constituents in areas where they pop up. This makes arguments for tax breaks for datacenters seem illogical, at best.

Unilaterally, these favorable arguments come down to something like: "Well, if they didn't offer the tax break here, then Metazonaigoog will just build their new datacenter somewhere else instead!"

To which I can only retort: "Really? You promise? Don't threaten me with a good time -- go ahead and build it somewhere else."

[wyre]

>data centers of this magnitude offer a ton of economic benefits to the area and the state

I have only seen this point being brought up by the exact people that will be owning the data centers with little data to back it up besides temporary construction jobs and few long term jobs, most jobs likely imported and not local.

I think states are offering huge incentives because the politicians approving the construction and tax cuts are easily bought out for pennies on the dollar. I don't know if Louisiana is known for being a paragon of honest politicians doing right by their constituents.

[83]

I find it bothersome because the system incentivizes giant megacorp monopolies. If you are small you'll have to pay taxes like everyone else, but once you hit some threshold of huge enough, we'll let taxes slide so you can get another leg up. A datacenter this size isn't going to provide more economic benefit than 50 datacenters 1/50 the size, but only one of them gets special treatment.

Combine that with the fact that large corporations constantly find ways to avoid paying taxes and its hard to be positive about this kind of thing.

[tormeh]

> Well said: why does a tax break bother people so much?

Several reasons. It distorts the market for one. One tax rate for me, another for thee. That's government picking favorites. Generally regarded as a bad thing.

[newfriend]

The entire tax code is full of these. For corporations and individuals as well. Are you advocating for a flat tax?

[83]

I'll bite. What's the downside of a flat tax for a category like datacenters? If Meta want's to negotiate a lower tax rate for datacenters that's great, just allow every datacenter to apply for that same rate then.

[hilariously]

Because its my money, paid to rich people, to make them richer. There's no obvious "net positive financial benefit" in many of these situations, and even if there was the impact they make is not just in financials, but in utility management, environmental management, etc - its not just a magic number go up.

[meric_]

It's not your money. Tax breaks are no ones money. No money is being sent for a tax break.

[LtWorf]

So if I don't pay your salary I'm not thieving because you never had the money in your pocket to begin with?

[hilariously]

If we all have a debt to pay and yours is wiped off the ledger for some bullshit so and my dollars have to stretch further to pay for something, you stole my money.

[drtz]

Providing tax breaks for construction that provides real, tangible benefits is one thing. Usually the argument is that a factory of some sort will provide long-term employment for residents.

What's the argument for a massive AI datacenter that employs very few people, strains infrastructure, and has the stated purpose of doing work that people had been doing, presumably reducing employment?

[rybosworld]

It depends on the deal structure but this is usually false:

> data centers of this magnitude offer a ton of economic benefits to the area and the state

Electricity cost increases are subsidized by residents: https://hls.harvard.edu/today/how-data-centers-may-lead-to-h...

Job creation is extremely minimal - data center build outs have some of the lowest job creation numbers per $ spent: https://goodjobsfirst.org/study-state-and-local-governments-...